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Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

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Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#91

Post by cschep »

alexktz wrote: post #55
zeeb wrote: post #47

I imagine the +$20k "market adjustment" markups on the F-150 lightning (and other EV's and hybrids) [0] by dealerships probably factored into this decision. [0]: https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2022/02/12/ford-gm-d...

It 100% factored into my decision to cancel my pre-order for a Lightning. The dealer said to me via email in December 2021: The latest communication is that order banks will open in January. Ford will be sending invitations to build / order in waves as to keep up with the demand. The invitations will be prioritized based on reservation time stamps. Your reservation is number 138 at our location. I have no way to trac…

Count me as another "will buy an f-150 lightning if they will take my money but not if I have to go through a dealer". I don't know how many of us there are but I really hope enough that I never have to go to a dealer again.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#92

Post by flashgordon »

So last year I was looking to buy a car (and now you know where I am going with this). I honestly went in thinking may be just perhaps dealerships have become less scummy after all these years. Boy was I in for a shock. Call it supply demand or what not the completely unscrupulous slapping of MVA on cars whose supply was constrained because of their miscalculation made me sooo damn mad. Heck I even wondered why the hell did Daniel Caruso chose to be a car dealer in Cobra Kai is beyond me!!!

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#93

Post by thrill »

kcb wrote: post #46
mesh wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He said "may not", which is the same as saying "may".

Ok...this isn't that hard. If someone says you may light on fire tomorrow. You're probably going to ask for a little bit of an explanation.

No, it's not that hard. He could have used the word "necessarily" after "not", but the meaning was still clear.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#94

Post by c4wrd »

paxys wrote: post #39

A lot has been said about the dealership model in the last few years, and the almost universal consensus is that it is an unnecessary and predatory industry and all auto makers should just sell cars directly like Tesla does. That being said, is there any counterpoint to this view? Are there any benefits that dealerships offer today over direct sales? What would we lose if we got rid of every dealership? If there is t…

In my opinion, we lose a lot, some things practical and others societal. Practically first, when I’m in the market for a new vehicle, I’m not sure which I honestly want. I like being able to go to a dealership and find something that convinced me otherwise from what I came to originally look at it. In the most recent case, I was really wanting a truck and being able to see them in person, how I fit, etc, was what sold me over one make versus another. Second, how does a future where there’s X car dealerships with different sites that I can’t easily compare across makes sound? Now it’s much harder for the average consumer to find a new vehicle. This will lead to aggregators, which will initially not be allowed up front because the manufacturer wants the full cut, but they’ll eventually concede.

Now societal. Sure, car dealerships may be “predatory” (I argue against that, some may be but most I’ve dealt with are opposite of that because they want your business), but at the end of the day it allows for more people to have jobs and participate in the economy. At some point we, technologists, are going to remove everyone’s job from them and we’ll act surprised societal uprisings happen because there’s no jobs available to the average Joe. Now I’m not arguing against automation, but car dealerships employ millions across the country, I don’t think removing those jobs from our fellow citizens who may or may not be able to do much more than sell cars, to no fault of their own, just to make a few more dollars for the manufacturer at “ease of the consumer”.

Once again these are my opinions, I’d love to hear from people who think this could be a good model for selling vehicles and will take them into full consideration.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#95

Post by smegger001 »

slt2021 wrote: post #8
phinnaeus wrote: post #2

I'm surprised they see spending less on advertising as part of their EV strategy. Copying Tesla in that regard might not work out the way they want it to. IMO Non-Tesla EVs are already facing an uphill awareness battle.

Ford is already ahead of Tesla in EV Trucks

Well tesla has seemed to trying shooting themselves in the foot with their truck rollout. Naming it "cyber truck" then making it look like a bad hot wheels, giving it a small bed with angled sided making it badly shaped for carrying many loads (like a pickups bed is meant for), using new manufacturing technique for its body which results in problems that slow production, bragging about it being indestructible then breaking it window trying to demonstrate how indestructible it is.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#96

Post by Closi »

vkou wrote: post #58
paxys wrote: post #39

A lot has been said about the dealership model in the last few years, and the almost universal consensus is that it is an unnecessary and predatory industry and all auto makers should just sell cars directly like Tesla does. That being said, is there any counterpoint to this view? Are there any benefits that dealerships offer today over direct sales? What would we lose if we got rid of every dealership? If there is t…

> That being said, is there any counterpoint to this view? 1. A national dealership network is at minimum, a soft-guarantee that your car can be maintained/recalled/fixed without you jumping through hoops. Unfortunately, that soft-guarantee is saddled with all the other baggage of car dealerships. Pushy sales-people, extended warranties, predatory loans, etc. 2. It forces you to buy local, so not all the money flows…

> 2. It forces you to buy local, so not all the money flows out of your community, and into Detroit - some of it stays to circulate in your town.

I think this is a kind of ‘broken window’ fallacy - ie unless there is a genuine service being offered then it’s kind of like requiring gardeners to use toe-clippers (ie the local economy are paying extra to hire people to do basically nothing).

> 3. People want to sell/trade their cars in, and Craigslist can be a pain in the ass.

Tesla offers a trade-in program so that appears to be similar in some respects?

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#98

Post by chiefalchemist »

lvl102 wrote: post #48

Counter: Ford dealerships actually give them a big advantage over Tesla. This is because there are close to 3,000 dealerships in the US compared to less than 200 for Tesla.

Maybe. You know the rule: I bet 20% of those dealerships do 80% of the sales. Or at least 80% of Ford's profits.

The overhead of HQ servicing each dealership is (approx) fixed. Some cover that with plenty to spare, others might be barely breakeven (after dealer incentives et al).

That said, even 20% of 3k is still 600 so that does feel like a positive for Ford (even without the dead weight).

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#99

Post by pavon »

phinnaeus wrote: post #21
datalopers wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you’re drastically underestimating how immensely popular the Ford F-150 is. Every single person who wants a truck knows about the F-150 and I’d wager the vast majority who may purchase an EV know about the F-150 Lightning or will find out as they start hitting the streets and they see them in parking lots and at stoplights.

But what percentage of those F-150 owners know there is an EV version? Or put another way, how many of them can you convert to an EV version with effective advertising?

The 2022 F-150 Lightning preorders filled up very quickly and far exceeded Ford's initial production plans. They will be supply limited for several years. Why spend a bunch of money on advertising when you already have more customers than product?

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#100

Post by kasey_junk »

phinnaeus wrote: post #21
datalopers wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you’re drastically underestimating how immensely popular the Ford F-150 is. Every single person who wants a truck knows about the F-150 and I’d wager the vast majority who may purchase an EV know about the F-150 Lightning or will find out as they start hitting the streets and they see them in parking lots and at stoplights.

But what percentage of those F-150 owners know there is an EV version? Or put another way, how many of them can you convert to an EV version with effective advertising?

Every single fleet sale in the country[0]. Tack on the transit electric and you’ve got enough work for the entire factory for years.

[0]obviously hyperbolic but fleet electric makes so much sense because many are already centrally parked and the rest can be trivially recharged at home much easier than dealing with gas.

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