Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy • Hacker News Board

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#91

Post by JohnHaugeland » Sun, Apr 10, 2022, 10:53 PM UTC

alkonaut wrote: post #90

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Has anyone ever tried microwave drilling? yes, many times. as you would expect, it obviously doesn't work. . > Using gyrotrons to generate enough microwave power to cut and weld glass has supposedly been tried. The company that was doing it seems to have disappeared. that's correct. they weren't able to cut two inches of well controlled non-porous dry material. . > You'd expect industrial applications first. honest…

So what is the secret sauce here? Is it a scam? Are they bringing anything new to the table? Their timeline is pretty tight with first rig in 2 years and commercial level first power plant in another 2. They should have demonstrated at least a couple of holes deeper than a few km by now you'd assume.

> So what is the secret sauce here?

There isn't one.

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> Is it a scam?

It won't work.

I do not have the ability to tell if it's a scam. They might really believe it. A scam would require them to know they were wrong.

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> Are they bringing anything new to the table?

No.

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> Their timeline is pretty tight with first rig in 2 years and commercial level first power plant in another 2.

You can't even build a bog standard coal plant that fast.

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> They should have demonstrated at least a couple of holes deeper than a few km by now you'd assume.

If you believed in them, yes, I'd agree.

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#92

Post by ncmncm » Mon, Apr 11, 2022, 12:27 AM UTC

karmajunkie wrote: post #82

ncmncm wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, so drilling into magma chambers might not be the best approach. Iceland sits on a big magma chamber, so they would need to proceed differently. Still, they have a lot of practical experience with utility-scale geothermal energy extraction the rest of us ought to learn from.

Seems like hitting a magma chamber would simply shorten the depth you have to drill to, or am I missing something? Geology and drilling are decidedly outside my areas of expertise.

Liquid rock is much messier to deal with than hot, solid rock. In particular, it is often under pressure, and full of dissolved volatiles, and wants to force its way up your borehole and all over your equipment, personnel, and neighborhood.

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#93

Post by ncmncm » Mon, Apr 11, 2022, 12:28 AM UTC

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #87

ncmncm wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, so drilling into magma chambers might not be the best approach. Iceland sits on a big magma chamber, so they would need to proceed differently. Still, they have a lot of practical experience with utility-scale geothermal energy extraction the rest of us ought to learn from.

the germane point is we've tried just about every kind of land, at this point, and none of them play out. could it work in 50 years? maybe. probably not. it's not working in 7 years, which is the climate change timeline. it's time to stop trying to chase new inventions, and just build 1970s nuclear.

Or abandon failed ideas like nukes, and build out what has proven overwhelmingly better on every axis.

A very respectable amount of utility power is generated geothermally, and has been for decades without mishap. What is new here is a drilling method. Power extraction from a hot borehole is mature tech.

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#94

Post by JohnHaugeland » Mon, Apr 11, 2022, 2:27 AM UTC

ncmncm wrote: post #93

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the germane point is we've tried just about every kind of land, at this point, and none of them play out. could it work in 50 years? maybe. probably not. it's not working in 7 years, which is the climate change timeline. it's time to stop trying to chase new inventions, and just build 1970s nuclear.

Or abandon failed ideas like nukes, and build out what has proven overwhelmingly better on every axis. A very respectable amount of utility power is generated geothermally, and has been for decades without mishap. What is new here is a drilling method. Power extraction from a hot borehole is mature tech.

> Or abandon failed ideas like nukes

which produce 778 billion kwh in the united states

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> A very respectable amount of utility power is generated geothermally

16 billion kwh

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> and has been for decades without mishap.

More deaths have occurred from geothermal, total, than nuclear, despite that nuclear delivers 48x the power.

Guatemala City: 33.

Dieng: 41.

Fenton Hill: 12.

Sorik Marapi: 5.

Soultz-sous-Foretz: 19.

Calpine: three times. 1, 5, 4.

El Salvador: 12.

Sumatera: 6.

Leyte: two incidents: 5, 17.

Sarulla: 18.

Brisbane: 14.

Reykavik: 2.

It'll get worse. AltaRock had to be stopped twice for causing earthquakes. Strasbourg was permanently stopped. So was dover. Pohang's earthquakes put a city under lockdown and killed two people.

There exists no decade since the launch of geothermal power where at least 25 people didn't die. Nuclear has only had that count once.

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#95

Post by lordofgibbons » Mon, Apr 11, 2022, 3:47 AM UTC

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #86

throwaway22032 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't the energy beam push you away from the surface just as well? I get that you don't need to exert torque, but you'd need to stabilise it somehow.

> Wouldn't the energy beam push you away from the surface just as well? do you believe lasers have thrust? you could cut through a planet with a laser and still not lift a one ounce weight off the ground with the "push back" laser ablation is the result of heat, not force

>do you believe lasers have thrust?

Absolutely. How do you think solar sails work? Light has inertia. If you emit large amounts of energy with any form of light, you'll get a thrust.

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#96

Post by throwaway22032 » Mon, Apr 11, 2022, 11:14 AM UTC

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #86

throwaway22032 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't the energy beam push you away from the surface just as well? I get that you don't need to exert torque, but you'd need to stabilise it somehow.

> Wouldn't the energy beam push you away from the surface just as well? do you believe lasers have thrust? you could cut through a planet with a laser and still not lift a one ounce weight off the ground with the "push back" laser ablation is the result of heat, not force

Lasers do have thrust, yeah. I guess I haven't done the maths to work out how much would be produced by a mining one :P

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#97

Post by JohnHaugeland » Mon, Apr 11, 2022, 2:05 PM UTC

lordofgibbons wrote: post #95

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wouldn't the energy beam push you away from the surface just as well? do you believe lasers have thrust? you could cut through a planet with a laser and still not lift a one ounce weight off the ground with the "push back" laser ablation is the result of heat, not force

>do you believe lasers have thrust? Absolutely. How do you think solar sails work? Light has inertia. If you emit large amounts of energy with any form of light, you'll get a thrust.

"Absolutely. How do you think solar sails work?"

By accumulating tiny pressure over decades in zero gravity where they face no friction.

It is not coincidental that you had to go to this extreme of an example.

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"Light has inertia."

I see you missed the part where I gave a factual accounting of how much inertia is dispensed.

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"If you emit large amounts of energy with any form of light, you'll get a thrust."

At the entire output of the Sun, you do not produce enough thrust to lift an average adult male human being in the gravity of the Earth.

Go do the math.

Re: Quaise Energy – Unlocking the true power of clean geothermal energy

#98

Post by ncmncm » Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 12:28 AM UTC

JohnHaugeland wrote: post #94

ncmncm wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or abandon failed ideas like nukes, and build out what has proven overwhelmingly better on every axis. A very respectable amount of utility power is generated geothermally, and has been for decades without mishap. What is new here is a drilling method. Power extraction from a hot borehole is mature tech.

> Or abandon failed ideas like nukes which produce 778 billion kwh in the united states . > A very respectable amount of utility power is generated geothermally 16 billion kwh . > and has been for decades without mishap. More deaths have occurred from geothermal, total, than nuclear, despite that nuclear delivers 48x the power. Guatemala City: 33. Dieng: 41. Fenton Hill: 12. Sorik Marapi: 5. Soultz-sous-Foretz: 19. C…

I am sure you have also totted up all the accidents that occurred mining, refining, or transporting uranium. And, everybody poisoned by runoff from mine tailings leaching into their water supply. (Some American Indian tribes, for example, have lawsuits on over that.) And, deaths in construction accidents during plant construction, and in transporting the thousands of tons of concrete and steel. And, mining the limestone, manufacturing the concrete, and mining and making the steel.

Oh, you haven't? My mistake.