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Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

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Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#91

Post by RobertMiller »

JohnTHaller wrote: post #79
RobertMiller wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No because those flu viruses were not novel, or as deadly. That information always lags reality. When/if the next deadly flu strain emerges, it will have emerged before it is discovered to have emerged. If you're not planning for this scenario, are you really planning for the worst case? You could be Patient Zero for Spanish Flu Part Two, with your preemptive masking being the difference between global disaster and…

We started masks when it became clear the Covid was far more contagious and deadly than the flu.

Not all flus are made equal, and the data about which flus are particularly deadly lags reality. If a flu as deadly as the Spanish Flu emerged again, you would be wise to worry about it. But until then? Until then, I suggest you go about your life.

We started wearing masks because covid actually existed, not because we feared that it might one day exist. Fear of hypothetical future covid strains is an example of the later, not the former. I'll consider fearing them once they actually exist, just like those hypothetical future flu strains.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#92

Post by RobertMiller »

Volundr wrote: post #83
tptacek wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might have worn a mask during previous flu seasons, but it'd be helpful to acknowledge that almost nobody else did. Prior to COVID, masks were a curiosity, not a norm.

> Prior to COVID, masks were a curiosity, not a norm. In the US and much of Europe. In other countries they absolutely were the norm. I'm not advocating for permanent mask wearing, but I absolutely DO think we should have shown more concern for others prior to Covid. It drove me nuts how many people would show up to work with "just a mild flu" or "just a cold" with no concern for the likelihood they might pass it on…

> In the US and much of Europe. In other countries they absolutely were the norm.

Only ever for people who actually felt sick. Not for all people by default regardless of how they felt. If I'm wrong please correct me, I'd love to know of this land where wearing surgical masks was the default expectation of everybody all the time.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#93

Post by jbaber »

moistly wrote: post #82
Reason077 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "once or twice in our lives for flu." I guess some people are more susceptible than others (or have more risk due to lifestyle factors), but only once or twice in a lifetime ? I'd guess I've had a really bad flu at least once every 4-5 years or so on average in my lifetime, and moderate cases probably every 1-2 years. I had Covid twice as well, within a year (both times in 2020, before vaccines were available).

Were those actually tested to prove they are a flu virus? Because typically, people say they have the flu when in actual they have a really bad cold.

I can't speak for this individual, but when kids are involved, it's normal to get tested and confirm, yes, you've gotten infected with influenza.

A year pre-covid my whole family (kids first) got the flu. Viral test confirmed one kid got two strains in succession ("A" and "B").

Its sudden onset, sudden remission, total body exhaustion, lack of my traditional cold symptoms, etc. made it very obviously different from any cold I'd had. Previous to that, I thought "the flu" was some strong "the common cold". Or just a word for arbitrary viral infection (e.g. "stomach flu").

I understand "the flu" has an ambiguous meaning now in English, but I'll certainly recognize that kind of infection again.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#95

Post by foxyv »

mupuff1234 wrote: post #22

Any ideas why we are seeing an upwards trend in COVID cases in europe as opposed to the US?

I think it may be the number of at-home tests that are out there now. People aren't going in for testing, just testing at home and not reporting it.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#96

Post by WaitWaitWha »

awb wrote: post #13
RobertMiller wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The flu once mutated to be very deadly, and there's no particular reason it couldn't happen again. For all anybody really knows, the next super deadly flu strain might show up tomorrow. Are you going to spend your life terrified of this "what if" scenario too?

Preparing for the worst and mitigating risk != being terrified

I thought this for a long long time too.

I have come to realize I was wrong.

If we humans always prepare for the worse, then indeed we will always be terrified. There is no way for us (I know for me) to decouple the nightmarish scenarios I ingested and prepared for, from my emotions. I want to be Spock [0], but I am not. I cannot be on the edge 24/7. I did that for decades (for work & life), it kills me and everyone around me. There is no way to enjoy this great world we live in.

So, what do I do? I try to find a "good enough" preparedness for me personally, and my family. Where is that "good enough" for me? It is just a touch more than the average preparedness. I do not have a bomb shelter, but I do have a "breakdown box" in my vehicles; I do not have hidden caches of food, ammo, household needs, but I have a well stacked pantry; and, so on.

[^0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spock

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#97

Post by dang »

terminatornet wrote: post #33
kazinator wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Long Covid" is mainly just hypochondria. A lot less of it is real than the hype would have you believe. The media loves spooky stuff because it generates clicks. Hypochondriacs are a thing: they are out there. Some of them have gotten Covid-19, and that of course turns into their new obsession.

interesting, i hadn't heard that. could you tell my what research university in your ass you pulled that out from?

Commenting like this will get you banned here. It's not what HN is for, and it destroys what it is for.

If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting, we'd appreciate it.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#98

Post by hollerith »

tptacek wrote: post #48
somewhereoutth wrote: post #4

It may well be less deadly, but it is far more contagious. Reinfection also seems to be not uncommon. We do not fully understand the long term effects of even a mild case, or indeed how repeated reinfection might compound any such effects, given that we might expect to catch it once or twice a year as opposed to once or twice in our lives for flu.

We don't fully understand the long-term effects of COVID, but there's not much we can realistically do about it (short of continuing the push to get everyone vaccinated). There is little evidence that NPIs are meaningfully effective at scale, at least when practiced in a way compatible with the normal functioning of society. I'm much more sympathetic to the death rate concerns (admittedly: Omicron makes it easy to ha…

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think "NPI" here means "non-pharmaceutical intervention".

What a horrible acronym! Was it coined by the pharmaceutical industry? "To fight COVID, we have vaccines, antivirals, steroids, novel pharmaceutical approaches, and then we have a miscellaneous category of non-pharmaceutical interventions."

You could've used "PPE" here. (personal protective equipment.)

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#99

Post by pvg »

hollerith wrote: post #98
tptacek wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't fully understand the long-term effects of COVID, but there's not much we can realistically do about it (short of continuing the push to get everyone vaccinated). There is little evidence that NPIs are meaningfully effective at scale, at least when practiced in a way compatible with the normal functioning of society. I'm much more sympathetic to the death rate concerns (admittedly: Omicron makes it easy to ha…

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think "NPI" here means "non-pharmaceutical intervention". What a horrible acronym! Was it coined by the pharmaceutical industry? "To fight COVID, we have vaccines, antivirals, steroids, novel pharmaceutical approaches, and then we have a miscellaneous category of non-pharmaceutical interventions." You could've used "PPE" here. (personal protective equipment.)

It's a term of art that's been around for decades and it means something different than what "PPE" means.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#100

Post by tonyedgecombe »

tastyfreeze wrote: post #20
bryanlarsen wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize there is a happy middle ground between hiding inside forever and pretending COVID doesn't exist, right?

Yes, that middle ground is stopping all required COVID mitigations and let people live their lives as they did before. COVID is here to stay. Time to start treating it like every other endemic disease. ps Pretty sure the comment you responded to was sarcasm.

That is pretty much what we have done in the UK.
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