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California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

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Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#91
post #21

> applies social justice principles to math lessons. ... huh? Does anyone know what this looks like?

I'm curious to see how this will turn out as other countries are not buying into this nonsense. In an increasingly competitive world this is a recipe for disaster.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#92
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there an achievement gap for other groups such as Asian students?

Asian students outperform their white peers. See https://infogram.com/mathdisparities-ag-1h984wd3y7lv2p3

This is exactly the reason NYC terminated the gifted and talented program. They're all so woke that they've reinvented anti-literacy laws.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems entirely arbitrary (if not false?). I was taught the basics of algebra and even trig (at least, how pi and radians work) in the 4th and 5th grade

Yes, but I'm talking about what works well for the average student, not just math whizs who post on HN.

You shouldn't optimize for the average student; you should stratify instruction so students of different levels are pushed to their limits and beyond.

Sure, some students will not be able to handle algebra as early as others. That doesn't mean you hold back the students who can. That's disastrous public policy, at the very least.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#94
Public school is just state sponsored daycare so parents can work full-time and be productive first. Then a means of socializing children so they can be minimally functional in society and also work and be productive. Lastly to produce individuals that can think for themselves.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many people that are good at math and love science / engineering decide to go into politics? I'm just talking without evidence but my guess is politics self selects for ambitious people that are completely inept when it comes to mathematics and critical thinking in general.

I think quite a bit. Congress regularly beats high end Wall Street investors when it comes to playing the equities market. This involves a great deal of understanding on mathematics topics involving everything from stats, probability and economics. They manage to do this part time while governing, so I'd have to say they are pretty adept. I could be missing something though.

Insider trading is what you're missing. As evidenced by the March 2020 dump

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#96
post #3

Well that's stupid. If anything they should introduce it sooner. There's tons of research that show the sooner it's introduced the better they are able to digest that (as in it becomes more second nature and are later able to reason with it and build off that knowledge better).

It's hard to introduce Algebra much earlier than 8th grade - the students just don't have the mathematical maturity for it. What you can do though is challenge and expose them to slightly more complex applications of ordinary math (often stated via increasingly elaborate "word problems") that make the introduction of algebra a lot more natural when the students are finally up for it. You tend to see this approach in…

I learned it in 7th since my 7-9 highschool had an option to test into it, and could have learned it in 6th.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, even 2x2 systems of equations. This stuff isn't hard, I don't get what the folks in the US are thinking.

They're thinking that teaching people stuff is promoting a diversity of outcomes , which is anathema at the moment. Diversity is supposed to only extend as far as categories one mustn't use to discriminate (age, race, sex, religion, etc.). If it occurs in other areas (achievement level, ability in particular subjects) ... oooh that's bad. Must make it stop.

I don't understand what this means. Where I went to school there were no gifted programs but we all were doing algebra and word problems much earlier than in the US. If people want consistent outcomes then teach everyone the same thing and hold everyone up to the same standards by investing more resources in students that are underachieving. That to me seems like a much better way of equalizing outcomes.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#98

Here's a revolutionary idea that pretty much all of the world adopts, if students are having trouble with a topic, get them to do more of it, instead of running away from it. I always find it hilarious that the pre college education in US is so messed up. Instead of doing Algebra 1, Algebra 2, calculus, geometry as one subject that you do in a year and then completely forgetting about it till the next time you have t…

I’ve never heard of anywhere in the US doing just one year of math. My family currently in high school are required to do math all 4 years.

No I didn't mean 1 year of math. Rather I meant breaking down math into these individual topics (that may or may not be compulsory) that you don't teach every year, makes the experience very disconnected.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#99

Here's a revolutionary idea that pretty much all of the world adopts, if students are having trouble with a topic, get them to do more of it, instead of running away from it. I always find it hilarious that the pre college education in US is so messed up. Instead of doing Algebra 1, Algebra 2, calculus, geometry as one subject that you do in a year and then completely forgetting about it till the next time you have t…

I'm British. For the lulz I decided to complete the US "GED": "The General Educational Development (GED) tests are a group of four subject tests which, when passed, provide certification that the test taker has United States or Canadian high school-level academic skills." (Wikipedia)

I had not looked at what it encompassed before I signed up. I was given a huge book to study from. I glanced at it briefly each day for two weeks and then sat for the exams.

I got 99% in all subjects. Apparently that was the maximum possible as the score went from 0-99% for reasons I didn't bother to explore.

It was disturbingly easy. And bear in mind that I was thrown out of my British secondary school at 16 because my exam scores were the worst on record at my school, allegedly.

Re: California moves to recommend delaying algebra to 9th grade statewide

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many people that are good at math and love science / engineering decide to go into politics? I'm just talking without evidence but my guess is politics self selects for ambitious people that are completely inept when it comes to mathematics and critical thinking in general.

I think quite a bit. Congress regularly beats high end Wall Street investors when it comes to playing the equities market. This involves a great deal of understanding on mathematics topics involving everything from stats, probability and economics. They manage to do this part time while governing, so I'd have to say they are pretty adept. I could be missing something though.

> I think quite a bit. Congress regularly beats high end Wall Street investors when it comes to playing the equities market

Politicians are not using math to decide which stocks to pick, they are using insider information.

edit: ok, it's clear that the parent comment was sarcasm now but you never know

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