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University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

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Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#91

Post by orangepurple »

chmod600 wrote: post #42

If schools have become as much political institutions as educational institutions -- and there's little doubt about that -- why do they get public money at all? The real conflict of interest here is politicians spending your money for their political goals.

The short answer is that the University of Florida, and American Universities in general, are not accountable to YOU OR ME, but rather a handful of bureaucrats in the federal government, and in this case specifically the NIH, which air drops the most cash on the institution.

Funding for NIH comes primarily from annual Labor, HHS, and Education (LHHS) Appropriations Acts, with an additional smaller amount for the Superfund Research Program from the Interior/Environment Appropriations Act.6 Those two bills provide NIH discretionary budget authority.

The NIH then presumably has the US Federal Reserve electronically wire it a few billion $ from an internal account they electronically added a few zeros to beforehand.

> UF received about $602 million in research funding from the federal government, including a record $250 million from the National Institutes of Health, the university’s largest research funding source.

https://news.ufl.edu/2021/08/research-awards-/

Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#92

Post by Ensorceled »

pyronik19 wrote: post #85
vilvo wrote: post #22

O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

If you have been paying attention to the rampant censorship by the tech oligopolies on behalf of the government requests you'd know that wasn't true.

I think you missed the '?' at the end of the verse ...

Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#93

Post by klyrs »

ModernMech wrote: post #37
elliekelly wrote: post #10

I have a colleague who does environmental litigation. (Think Erin Brockovich.) They have a big civil case against a large energy company in a southern, “energy-friendly” state. They had an expert witness all lined up - a professor at the (public!) state university. Well this expert happened to be up for tenure and was (allegedly) told in no uncertain terms that, should they testify as an expert witness in this case,…

As a professor, I think the actions of The University of Florida are abhorrent. I would never want to work in an environment that kowtows to politics. There are enough political considerations within a University, but having to deal with state politics as well? Count me out. At the same time, he doesn’t have tenure? So they are actually fully within their rights to do this, and really no one should be surprised. But…

> So they are actually fully within their rights to do this, and really no one should be surprised.

They have the power, nobody should be surprised that they flex it. Maybe. Do you feel that it's always ethical to perform every action that is within your legal rights? Is the legal system devoid of examples, where an act was legal until it was exercised in excess, and found to be unethical? "Surprised" doesn't describe my response to this abuse of power. That would be "outrage".

Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#94

Post by driverdan »

ModernMech wrote: post #37
elliekelly wrote: post #10

I have a colleague who does environmental litigation. (Think Erin Brockovich.) They have a big civil case against a large energy company in a southern, “energy-friendly” state. They had an expert witness all lined up - a professor at the (public!) state university. Well this expert happened to be up for tenure and was (allegedly) told in no uncertain terms that, should they testify as an expert witness in this case,…

As a professor, I think the actions of The University of Florida are abhorrent. I would never want to work in an environment that kowtows to politics. There are enough political considerations within a University, but having to deal with state politics as well? Count me out. At the same time, he doesn’t have tenure? So they are actually fully within their rights to do this, and really no one should be surprised. But…

> So they are actually fully within their rights to do this, and really no one should be surprised.

If it's a public institution the 1st amendment applies. Public institutions should not be applying any limits to employee speech.

Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#95

Post by mercy_dude »

Good news is and many in the academic sphere may not realize this - many faculties universities are going to go out of business at this rate. One silver lining during this time has been, many have realized how much they are overpaying for things they can learn online or through their own efforts. There is no reason you need to spend 200k+ for a degree in Sociology and Gender Studies.

Other than medicine, law a few science majors I don’t foresee much of the faculties in universities survive assuming the cooler heads prevail, and parents and society realize sending your kids on their way to mortgage their entire twenties for a piece of paper that can be learned through community college and online studies is worthless.

Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#96

Post by debacle »

elliekelly wrote: post #10

I have a colleague who does environmental litigation. (Think Erin Brockovich.) They have a big civil case against a large energy company in a southern, “energy-friendly” state. They had an expert witness all lined up - a professor at the (public!) state university. Well this expert happened to be up for tenure and was (allegedly) told in no uncertain terms that, should they testify as an expert witness in this case,…

The problem is that people are all for consolidation of power when it's going to further their ends.

The American political system has become completely unprincipled, largely as a result of decades long attacks on moderates.

Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#97

Post by denton-scratch »

aigo wrote: post #65
productivepizza wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you provide links with information on countries that have discovered election fraud and banned mail-in voting? I could not find anything with a quick google search.

In the UK we did discover some postal voting fraud in a 2014 local election in an area of London called Tower Hamlets. We did not ban postal voting as a result. We have, however, imported a voter ID law from the US which was recently passed by the Johnson government, despite no voter impersonation occurring in Tower Hamlets (or anywhere else really). Previously, no ID was required.

I think the majority of "postal voting fraud" in the UK consists of very patriarchal families in which the father directs family members as to how to vote, and submits the votes himself. Arguably, this isn't much different from persuading people to change their voting intentions, which is entirely legitimate. Postal voting used to be restricted to people who could show that they were unable to vote in-person, e.g. because they were in the armed services.

I disapprove strongly of that patriarchal practice; but (1) I doubt it has much effect on outcomes, (2) mandatory in-person voting wouldn't prevent it (the patriarch can still instruct his family members).

I also disapprove of early voting. I believe that to cast a vote legitimately, you have to pay some attention to the hustings and the arguments. That is not a barricade I will die defending, though - the tide is against me.

AFAIAA, the UK has not imported a voter ID law from the US. There was a trial at the last election, in a handful of constituencies, and there is mandatory photographic ID for voting in Northern Ireland. A voter ID law was proposed in the Queen's Speech, but no legislation has been tabled or debated.

For the most part, voters receive a poll card in the post, which they don't have to produce at the polling station. You can just turn up, state your name and address, and cast a ballot. Your name is then crossed-out in the voter register, so that the same name-and-address can't vote more than once.

Re: University of Florida bars professors from testifying in a voting rights case

#100

Post by moate »

endisneigh wrote: post #64
dahart wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw your mention of conflict of interest down lower, but you did in fact leave the conflict of interest out of your first summary sentence, the part before “in other words”. It definitely leaves the wrong initial impression, and leaves a discrepancy between the two explanations on either side of “in other words”. > There's no conspiracy here. What is your evidence? It’s entirely possible the state threatened the un…

> What is your evidence? It’s entirely possible the state threatened the university’s funding. And some politicians do seem to be conspiring to prevent certain classes of US citizens from voting. I already showed you a link. The same professor has already testified against the state when under control by the same government about the same issue (voting rights). If you have proof showing there's a conspiracy I'd love…

>>The same professor has already testified against the state when under control by the same government about the same issue (voting rights).

Point of order: During the 2018 political cycle, there was not the same massive push by the party in power of Florida to promote an "election fraud is a massive existential threat to our democracy" narrative in the same way there was during 2020 and beyond.

Pretending a massive change in direction didn't happen in the intervening years seems either extremely naïve or disingenuous.

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