On YouTube’s recommendation system • Hacker News Board

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#91

Post by spywaregorilla » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:09 PM UTC

I find it pretty decent if you tell it you don't like certain videos. But it fails to identify obvious, literal sequels to your current video. And if you don't trim it, it will surely feed you clickbait garbage.

On some level people love to click on things they expect to hate and downvote it. I suspect that increases the odds of showing them similar content, vs. say, spotify which explicitly says "sorry we will try to avoid things like this". Youtube should make it clear which strategy they're doing, and they should do the latter.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#92

Post by kenjackson » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:11 PM UTC

jeffwask wrote: post #44

swalsh wrote: post #11

The reccomendation system is absolutely dangerous. Just this summer, I watched one video on peppers out of curiousity. By the end of summer I've got multiple different varieties growing, and all the accessories to support them. I'm really enjoying my garden, but it's very unlikely I would have started one without the youtube algorithm. Similarly my doctor reccomended I exercise more, so I started running. Then I goog…

It's sad because I remember being able to find new and interesting creators passively. Now the main page is all corporate BS and the algorithm locks you in. We played a bit of WOW Classic last year and all of a sudden I was just flooded with Asmongold videos and videos of people clipping and replaying Asmongold. It took a day of "never show this again" to make it stop.

What corporate stuff do you have on your main page? Mine is all pretty much filled with content that matches what I watch.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#93

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:12 PM UTC

swalsh wrote: post #11

The reccomendation system is absolutely dangerous. Just this summer, I watched one video on peppers out of curiousity. By the end of summer I've got multiple different varieties growing, and all the accessories to support them. I'm really enjoying my garden, but it's very unlikely I would have started one without the youtube algorithm. Similarly my doctor reccomended I exercise more, so I started running. Then I goog…

[deleted]

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#94

Post by notJim » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:13 PM UTC

cronix wrote: post #39

lordentropy wrote: post #5

For me, it seems like youtube's recommendation system mostly gets stuck in the local optimum. Once you watch a video from a particular channel, it'll keep on recommending the videos from the same channel for months. Soon, the recommendation just consists of stuff from the channels that have you already viewed. You rarely see new types of recommendations.

Visit in incognito mode and don't sign in. Brand new, fresh youtube, ready to be corrupted again.

I've found YouTube's defaults for a lightly-used profile (my work Google account) tend to be like Charlie Kirk/Ben Shapiro owning the libs type garbage.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#95

Post by sbierwagen » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:13 PM UTC

barbazoo wrote: post #46

sbierwagen wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're logged in, hover over the video, click the three dot menu, then select "Not Interested". If you are not logged in you can't do this, for obvious algo manipulation reasons.

You're right but somehow I would think that YT should know which videos I've already watched...

There's lots of music on youtube. Some "videos" get rewatched hundreds of times.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#96

Post by steveklabnik » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:14 PM UTC

cma wrote: post #80

steveklabnik wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who had a bit of a YouTube hobby and is trying to get back into it, I've generally found that the algorithm brings me a larger audience than I would have otherwise. I've published three videos in the last 28 days, and my analytics says I've gotten 5200 views across all my content in that time. I have about a hundred subscribers. Search is still king, but 15% of those views have come from suggested. I've go…

Like Facebook now does for "boosting" post shares, I wonder when the YT algorithm will start incorporating pay to win mechanics.

It seems like YouTube has realized that winner-takes-all is bad for the health of the platform, and is trying to grow smaller creators. I suspect they won't do this, because they realize that it ultimately strangles growth. Mr. Beast (for example) is already spending about $4MM/month on making videos; if they allowed this kind of stuff, well... not many people could compete.

We'll see though!

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#97

Post by BeetleB » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:14 PM UTC

exolymph wrote: post #50

LarryDarrell wrote: post #17

> 3. Do recommendations drive viewers to increasingly extreme content? > As I’ve explained, we actively demote low-quality information in recommendations. But we also take the additional step of showing viewers authoritative videos about topics that may interest them. Say I watch a video about the COVID-19 vaccine. In my Up Next panel, I’ll see videos from reputable sources like Vox and Bloomberg Quicktake and won’t…

I'm sorry that you're in this painful situation. Personally I don't think the root problem is YouTube — rather, it's your parents' confirmation bias. They want to believe these things. I've watched Alex Jones videos myself. I did not leave wanting more and no recommendation algo could change that. (Lest I leave the wrong impression, the same is true of AOC going live on IG.)

> Personally I don't think the root problem is YouTube — rather, it's your parents' confirmation bias. They want to believe these things.

The thing is, most people, including likely you and me, have some defect. Some aspect of constructing a "good" society[1] is setting up systems to counter the effect of these defects. If you have a system that fosters a person's defects, it is fair to be critical of it.

Or put a simpler way: It's as fair to criticize the Youtube algorithm as it is to criticize a newspaper that only prints positive news about white people and negative news about non-whites. Sure - any given reader can choose which newspaper he/she will read, and the root cause is the reader's bias, but I think most would agree it's a problematic newspaper that is making a bad problem worse.

[1] Whatever that means.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#98

Post by badmadrad » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:16 PM UTC

notanzaiiswear wrote: post #81

"videos from reputable sources like Vox" - yeah, right... I wonder who that article is addressed to? At first it may seem they want to reassure viewers that they will get shown the best content. But the longer the article goes on, the more it sounds like a reassurance that they will absolutely block out unwanted political views. Why do they feel the need to put out such an article? To stave of government regulation?…

exactly, they are proud to tell you they block videos that are "problematic" from being recommended. But problematic to whom or what is not described. As this would surely reveal their bias in their algorithms. And also who our overlords are.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#99

Post by Asmod4n » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:19 PM UTC

jeffwask wrote: post #44

swalsh wrote: post #11

The reccomendation system is absolutely dangerous. Just this summer, I watched one video on peppers out of curiousity. By the end of summer I've got multiple different varieties growing, and all the accessories to support them. I'm really enjoying my garden, but it's very unlikely I would have started one without the youtube algorithm. Similarly my doctor reccomended I exercise more, so I started running. Then I goog…

It's sad because I remember being able to find new and interesting creators passively. Now the main page is all corporate BS and the algorithm locks you in. We played a bit of WOW Classic last year and all of a sudden I was just flooded with Asmongold videos and videos of people clipping and replaying Asmongold. It took a day of "never show this again" to make it stop.

I’m hitting never show this again on one type of content all the time. There are days where my feed consists of like 33% of that stuff and it happens all the time. I’m at the point where it only recommends me my subscribed channels or the stuff I tell it not to show at all some days too. It’s so frustrating.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#100

Post by markus_zhang » Fri, Sep 17, 2021, 7:22 PM UTC

One thing I don't like the recommendation system is that it offers videos I already watched and even bookmarked. It also offered videos from people I subscribed but this is OK-ish because some accounts have hundreds or even thousands of videos.

Basically, all recommendation system are based on one hypothesis: I know more about your preference than yourself. I can't say I agree with it.