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I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

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Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#91

Post by vajrabum »

jaywalk wrote: post #86
CarelessExpert wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Every jurisdiction reporting actual, real data and not just rumours on Fox News has indicated that over 90% of Covid admissions are unvaccinated, even in areas with greater than 50% of the population with two doses.

There's nothing I can show you that would make you believe what I'm saying, so I'm not going to try. But I will say that I heard it directly from a doctor in a high-level position at a large-ish hospital. I know him very well, and he has zero reason to lie to me about it. But yeah, I'm probably lying (or being lied to) and it's all BS. Whatever works for you. The media (aside from Fox News) is always 100% truthful an…

The simple fact that you aren't willing to offer any evidence when asked for it does in fact make you and your assertion appear to be a lot less credible. This is public data at least anywhere in the US. Where is this largish hospital? Inquiring minds want to know.

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#92

Post by dariusj18 »

jaywalk wrote: post #86
CarelessExpert wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Every jurisdiction reporting actual, real data and not just rumours on Fox News has indicated that over 90% of Covid admissions are unvaccinated, even in areas with greater than 50% of the population with two doses.

There's nothing I can show you that would make you believe what I'm saying, so I'm not going to try. But I will say that I heard it directly from a doctor in a high-level position at a large-ish hospital. I know him very well, and he has zero reason to lie to me about it. But yeah, I'm probably lying (or being lied to) and it's all BS. Whatever works for you. The media (aside from Fox News) is always 100% truthful an…

Perhaps they or you just misunderstood the context or statistic that was presented. It might not be possible (or advisable), but you could disclose the name of the hospital and we could follow up with them to validate the claim.

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#93

Post by CodeGlitch »

chrismcb wrote: post #47
RyJones wrote: post #2

I can. I got my shots as soon as I could, but I know lots of people that will never do it. Yesterday I was eating at a ramen shop - traffic was slow, so I got to listen to the bulletproof young man waiting tables talk to his friend at length about how he'd never get the shot, just like the flu, I'm not an anti-vaxxer - but, I don't wear tinfoil hats - but. The list of reasons not to do it was long and apparently conv…

I'm curious, if you are young, what are the reasons to get vaccinated?

The more people it infects (even if it is young healthy people), the greater chance of more deadly strain. COVID-19 isn't that deadly, but is highly infectious. What happens if it mutates into something like this (another form of the coronavirus):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_East_respiratory_syndro...

(34% chance of death).

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#94

Post by revalo »

Alupis wrote: post #26

Folks - if someone you know is not vaccinated at this point in time (in the US) - it's entirely on them if they get sick. And guess what - they already know this, made that decision, and nothing you rant and rave about is going to change it. Quit trying to drum up some mandatory vaccine rhetoric - or villianize these people. Just leave them alone and go about your life in whatever way you think is appropriate for you…

Adding to the thoughts before, letting the virus spread and mutate among the unvaccinated to create a new variant sounds like a reset on the progress we've made. With the Delta we got lucky, our vaccines still largely work. I'm not sure how long the luck will hold on with more variants.

I'm all for leaving people alone to their own decisions. But with this, their decisions greatly affect me and society at large.

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#95

Post by umvi »

CarelessExpert wrote: post #84
umvi wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh, in what way was it off by a factor of 10? Population of USA is 330M [0] 2,854,838 registered deaths in 2019, which is 0.8% of the population, or about 8 in 1000 [1] As of December 31 2020, around 400k people had died of covid in the USA, but let's just be conservative and pretend 600k people died in 2020. 600k out of 330M is 0.18% of the population or about 2 in 1000 [2] [0] https://www.worldometers.info/world-p…

Nah, it's the part where you and the author conveniently fail to point out that that 600k fatality number (which is close to the current number in the US) is after taking truly historic measures to prevent disease transmission. Had we truly done nothing that number would be significantly higher. But, of course, as was so very predictable at the start, because these measures were in fact pretty effective at slowing sp…

I padded the death count by 50% to account for this in the story (400k people died of covid in the USA in 2020, not 600k).

If you compare covid deaths per capita across various states, you won't find huge differences even though some states had extreme restrictions in place (California) and some states had lax restrictions in place (Utah, Florida, etc).

Say there's a parallel universe where masks and social distancing were encouraged but optional and business were not forced to shut down and people were not ordered to shelter in place. How much higher is the covid death count per year in this fictional parallel universe? More than 50%? 2-3x higher? If you have any real-world examples you could point to to make your case, that would be helpful.

Anyway, all this doesn't really matter though, because you missed the point of the story. The point of the story was that (for Statisticsville, at least) the people were so busy fighting amongst themselves about what actions to take (or not) about an infectious disease that they didn't realize the deadly side effects of that social discord until it was too late.

Will the USA avoid the deadly consequences of its current social discord and become a united people again before it's too late? Stay tuned to find out!

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#96

Post by jaywalk »

vajrabum wrote: post #91
jaywalk wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing I can show you that would make you believe what I'm saying, so I'm not going to try. But I will say that I heard it directly from a doctor in a high-level position at a large-ish hospital. I know him very well, and he has zero reason to lie to me about it. But yeah, I'm probably lying (or being lied to) and it's all BS. Whatever works for you. The media (aside from Fox News) is always 100% truthful an…

The simple fact that you aren't willing to offer any evidence when asked for it does in fact make you and your assertion appear to be a lot less credible. This is public data at least anywhere in the US. Where is this largish hospital? Inquiring minds want to know.

Is it public data anywhere in the US? I know that my state (Michigan) doesn't break down hospitalizations by vaccination status. Or if they do, it's not with the rest of the Covid data they put out online.

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#97

Post by jaywalk »

dariusj18 wrote: post #92
jaywalk wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing I can show you that would make you believe what I'm saying, so I'm not going to try. But I will say that I heard it directly from a doctor in a high-level position at a large-ish hospital. I know him very well, and he has zero reason to lie to me about it. But yeah, I'm probably lying (or being lied to) and it's all BS. Whatever works for you. The media (aside from Fox News) is always 100% truthful an…

Perhaps they or you just misunderstood the context or statistic that was presented. It might not be possible (or advisable), but you could disclose the name of the hospital and we could follow up with them to validate the claim.

There was no misunderstanding. I'm not going to disclose the name of the hospital, which I'm sure you can understand.

I'm just relaying an anecdote that was told to me by someone who would know. I can't offer anything more than that, and I completely understand why anyone would choose not to believe it.

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#98

Post by jaywalk »

CarelessExpert wrote: post #90
jaywalk wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing I can show you that would make you believe what I'm saying, so I'm not going to try. But I will say that I heard it directly from a doctor in a high-level position at a large-ish hospital. I know him very well, and he has zero reason to lie to me about it. But yeah, I'm probably lying (or being lied to) and it's all BS. Whatever works for you. The media (aside from Fox News) is always 100% truthful an…

> There's nothing I can show you that would make you believe what I'm saying Real data from a reputable source would be more than sufficient. Remarkable how you seem to be unable to produce any...

Do you have real data from a reputable source that says otherwise?

I'm talking about hospitalizations broken down by vaccination status. Not cases, not symptomatic cases, not deaths. Hospitalizations.

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#99

Post by Alupis »

revalo wrote: post #94
Alupis wrote: post #26

Folks - if someone you know is not vaccinated at this point in time (in the US) - it's entirely on them if they get sick. And guess what - they already know this, made that decision, and nothing you rant and rave about is going to change it. Quit trying to drum up some mandatory vaccine rhetoric - or villianize these people. Just leave them alone and go about your life in whatever way you think is appropriate for you…

Adding to the thoughts before, letting the virus spread and mutate among the unvaccinated to create a new variant sounds like a reset on the progress we've made. With the Delta we got lucky, our vaccines still largely work. I'm not sure how long the luck will hold on with more variants. I'm all for leaving people alone to their own decisions. But with this, their decisions greatly affect me and society at large.

You won't stop mutations. It's a pandemic, world-wide - and short of blocking all international travel, freight/shipping, etc - if there is a new mutation somewhere in the world, it will eventually land here in the US.

Herd immunity - either reached by vaccinations, previous-infections, or both - is all we can hope for.

Good news is, we don't need unvaccinated people's cooperation to reach herd immunity - they will eventually have natural immunity anyway.

Re: I’m an ICU Doctor and I Can't Believe What Unvaccinated Patients Are Saying

#100

Post by Alupis »

mcguire wrote: post #81
Alupis wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would seem it's exceptionally rare, and even more rare to develop complications or death.[1] And the only people they can transit it to that would be "at-risk" are people who've had the vaccine available to them for free, for months and chosen explicitly to not get it. That's their choice, and we should not cripple the country over it. [1] https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/CID/DCDC/Pages/COVID-19/COV...

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.10.20210492v... It's a good thing only about 2.7% of the adult population of US is immunocompromised.

I can't tell if you're being facetious or not, forgive me.

We can't base policy off something that effects an extreme minority of the population, like this 2.7% statistic you cited. We'd never do anything if that were the case...

The affected people should take all necessary precautions available (get vaccinated if applicable, wear a N95 or KN95 mask, shelter isolated at home, etc). Everyone else needs to go back to work, school, stores, restaurants, etc.

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