Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

bbc.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 531 posts

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#91

Post by cbushko »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #10
oblio wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will stop, at some point. IT is still growing but we're reaching the point where IT workers are a decent percentage of all workers, so they are starting to become representative of the population at large. Larger and larger cohorts of IT workers are aging and recent graduates will stop being enough even for the top companies. Also, salaries are lower in general but I get the impression Europe is better in this reg…

I could probably go to the Web sites of at least a dozen successful IT companies, and go to the "Meet the Team" page. They are invariably a large group of smiling -young- faces. There may be one or two greyhairs in the picture, but a quick shufti of the "Leadership" page often shows them to be C-suite or Board. Yeah, I'm a cynic.

When you are old, everyone looks young. =)

I see 35 year olds and think "that guy is just a kid"!

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#92

Post by cogman10 »

honkdaddy wrote: post #77
bko wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a market economy there is no such thing as a "shortage" of workers. You just don't want to meet the market price of the workers with that skill set. You could imagine a widget factory whose economics rely on paying employees X, it doesn't mean there's a "shortage" of workers, but the workers demand a wage that makes your work unprofitable. The fact is a lot of people are paid not to work through generous covid-rel…

What would you call it if we had 5 positions at the widget factory, but only 4 prospective employees looking for work? Wouldn't that constitute a worker shortage, as no matter how high I make my wages as a widget foreman, there are still less workers than there are open positions? Or is that not something that could really happen outside of a textbook problem?

What are your requirements for the widget employees? Are you willing to train or educate? How effective has your advertisement for the job/wage been?

On a microlevel, a worker shortage is a reflection of lack of wage and too strict requirements. You can't find a worker because your potential workers are happily doing a different jobs. You've not incentivized them enough to come work for you. You might say "But we are offering $15/hour!" and that's fine, but that's what a lot of other companies are now offering. You make balk at the idea of going up further as being "too much" but that just underscores the problem.

Now if it truly is a labor shortage, SOMEONE is going to be left with not enough workers. That'll always be the person that wants "15 years of experience! We pay $30k/year!".

Just do the extreme. Do you think you'd struggle to find someone if the offering was "$200k/year!"? Hell no, you'd have people moving to live in your widget city for that job.

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#93

Post by lucb1e »

throw_m239339 wrote: post #46

There is no "employee shortage". I don't know the reason why the main stream press started to roll with that narrative but this is a blatant lie. However unlike before the pandemic, some candidates might refuse a job that only offers a pittance, especially given the high inflation in most of the west.

> unlike before the pandemic, some candidates might refuse a job

I don't understand this one, wouldn't a pandemic (entire industries had to cut back on costs) cause more people to be looking for work and thus tip the supply and demand balance towards people being less picky?

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#94

Post by djbebs »

honkdaddy wrote: post #77
bko wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a market economy there is no such thing as a "shortage" of workers. You just don't want to meet the market price of the workers with that skill set. You could imagine a widget factory whose economics rely on paying employees X, it doesn't mean there's a "shortage" of workers, but the workers demand a wage that makes your work unprofitable. The fact is a lot of people are paid not to work through generous covid-rel…

What would you call it if we had 5 positions at the widget factory, but only 4 prospective employees looking for work? Wouldn't that constitute a worker shortage, as no matter how high I make my wages as a widget foreman, there are still less workers than there are open positions? Or is that not something that could really happen outside of a textbook problem?

Thats not something that happens in real life, because you will run out of resources to pay the prospective workers with before the total supply of prospective workers is exhausted.

Realistically, you can even hire people to manufacture additional workers, if you have the financial and time resources required.

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#95

Post by kikiakaki »

phenkdo wrote: post #17
calltrak wrote: post #7

I am an unemployed programmer. I am 50 years old. I have 15 years of C#, 15 years of sql server, two years of golang, two years of node.js, vue.js, svelte, css, html, postgress, rabbitmq, etc etc etc.... My skills list is about 10 times this short list I just threw up. They tell me there is a skills and labor shortage in tech. That's complete bullshit I am UNEMPLOYED for a year. I don't believe one dam word the gover…

It stretches credulity that you have that many skills and still unemployed. Employers are hiring just about anyone in tech these days. Where are you located? You can kvetch about the media all you want, but the job market is the best it has ever been, and unlikely to get any better. Sorry to be harsh here, but if you can't find a job in this market, you ought to reconsider your professional choices.

"Hey, it's so awesome for me!!! You must be a liar, because for me it's all cool."

Is this all your argument or did you also want to say something meaningful?

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#96

Post by detaro »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #10
oblio wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will stop, at some point. IT is still growing but we're reaching the point where IT workers are a decent percentage of all workers, so they are starting to become representative of the population at large. Larger and larger cohorts of IT workers are aging and recent graduates will stop being enough even for the top companies. Also, salaries are lower in general but I get the impression Europe is better in this reg…

I could probably go to the Web sites of at least a dozen successful IT companies, and go to the "Meet the Team" page. They are invariably a large group of smiling -young- faces. There may be one or two greyhairs in the picture, but a quick shufti of the "Leadership" page often shows them to be C-suite or Board. Yeah, I'm a cynic.

I wonder if there's a corelation in the sense that the young-biased "startup-y" companies are more likely to even have something like a "meet the team" page. (I.e. you kind of need to be below a certain size, and even then plenty places don't have them)

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#97

Post by lucb1e »

calltrak wrote: post #7

I am an unemployed programmer. I am 50 years old. I have 15 years of C#, 15 years of sql server, two years of golang, two years of node.js, vue.js, svelte, css, html, postgress, rabbitmq, etc etc etc.... My skills list is about 10 times this short list I just threw up. They tell me there is a skills and labor shortage in tech. That's complete bullshit I am UNEMPLOYED for a year. I don't believe one dam word the gover…

> I don't believe one dam word the government or the media says anymore. Not one word. Not about the cough.

If you really mean this, if you really think the pandemic is all a big conspiracy created by your government... makes me genuinely curious how you come across in interviews.

I don't think you're wrong about the labor shortage thing. Similar story here: quite a bit of trouble finding a job as a 25 year old tech person while you hear left and right that nobody can seem to find any employees anymore. But that one statistic is skewed, or perhaps that companies and employees aren't properly being matched, doesn't mean "the cough" (and what many people that contracted the virus describe as the worst week in their life) is all a big hoax.

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#98

Post by lumost »

m0llusk wrote: post #88

It is strange that the top known factors for this are not even mentioned in this or other similar news stories. First, closing of schools caused large numbers of women to leave the workforce in order to care for children. Until schools are fully open and day care is available those women will probably not be going back to work. Second, all markets are cultivated things. Employers in the most troubled sectors have rec…

It’s funny, I hear a ton about worker productivity and similar worker centric views of production, labor, and wages. But, as any Walmart, warehouse, or even pizza shop worker will tell you - their ability to negotiate wages, change production practices, or make any difference in the workplace amounts to a suggestion box and a 25 cent raise.

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#99

Post by forz877 »

School-Cotton wrote: post #18
calltrak wrote: post #7

I am an unemployed programmer. I am 50 years old. I have 15 years of C#, 15 years of sql server, two years of golang, two years of node.js, vue.js, svelte, css, html, postgress, rabbitmq, etc etc etc.... My skills list is about 10 times this short list I just threw up. They tell me there is a skills and labor shortage in tech. That's complete bullshit I am UNEMPLOYED for a year. I don't believe one dam word the gover…

For what it’s worth: I live in NYC. It is not boarded up.

That's the narrative a lot of these people living in the flyover states are fed on repeat 24/7.

You'd think NYC , SF, LA were third world countries according to them. You can tell right from his comment why he likely doesn't have a job.

Re: Employee shortages: Where have all the workers gone?

#100

Post by info781 »

peakaboo wrote: post #42
oblio wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will stop, at some point. IT is still growing but we're reaching the point where IT workers are a decent percentage of all workers, so they are starting to become representative of the population at large. Larger and larger cohorts of IT workers are aging and recent graduates will stop being enough even for the top companies. Also, salaries are lower in general but I get the impression Europe is better in this reg…

Salaries may be lower but work/life balance seems much higher in Europe.

If you offer an American a choice between more money or more vacation, they will take the money, for the most part.
Post reply on HN