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British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

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Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#91

Post by GrayShade »

fsflover wrote: post #54
nerdawson wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TV manufacturers are responding, often clumsily and based on their self-interest (data collection), to what consumers want. Trying to find a dumb TV is like trying to find a car without a built in radio. You're welcome to leave it switched off. Smart TVs are dumb if they aren't connected to the internet. Some may be slow. Some may have a poor interface. I'd worry about solving for that rather than expecting manufactu…

> Smart TVs are dumb if they aren't connected to the internet. Unless they find an open WiFi network.

Or they start shipping with SIM cards.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#93

Post by alias_neo »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #75
tuukkah wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here, a computer might be interpreted as a laptop or a desktop, not an embedded system "with a computer in them". Anyway, the list is very short and exclusive (for now?): "For now, the right to repair laws only cover: Dishwashers; Washing machines and washer-dryers; Refrigeration appliances; Televisions and other electronic displays"

IME washing machines, dishwashers, washer-dryers all have relatively good repairability and good parts availability already (fridges too, though I've less experience of that). You even see them being scored on repairability or repair costs. Have they addressed a problem that is largely absent? It's hard to choose to repair when a secondhand replacement is as cheap though. Replaced a plastic pipe, and a hose on my dis…

I live in a London new-build flat. Mine and several of my neighbours washing machines gave out at the same time, all in the same month, all roughly 3 years in. These came with the flats of course.

I would repair it, but having watched a YouTube video on how it's done, the cost in tools, parts and effort (it's a full disassembly) to make the relatively simple repair I cannot justify over buying a better model of my choosing.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#94

Post by mmis1000 »

bluGill wrote: post #46
cunidev wrote: post #40

Not even mentioning the hardware bits, I have been collaborating with postmarketOS for a while now, and believe that the main thing we need to make those devices longer-lasting would be an unlockable bootloader by law. This sounds so logical (why cannot I run, by voiding the warranty, any code I want on my machine, whatever it is?), yet apparently so hard to make openly illegal, since the problem is barely acknowledg…

You can't do that because someone (probably not you) will then unlock the phone and [insert something evil here - perhaps involving the radio]

Android phones triggers wipe on unlock. So use unlock bootloader to stole data simply don't work.

Besides that, some phone will add a unremovble giant red exclamation mark on boot screen to notate the phone being unlocked to warn you `the phone is already unlocked, don't trust it unless it is done by you.`

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#95

Post by jkingsman »

nerdawson wrote: post #72
fsflover wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Smart TVs are dumb if they aren't connected to the internet. Unless they find an open WiFi network.

Automatically connecting to an open WiFi network without being instructed to do so seems reckless to say the least. Are you aware of any TVs that are doing that?

Not directly a TV, but Amazon Sidewalk is building a mesh network in residential areas for pretty much this purpose.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#96

Post by waych »

bitwize wrote: post #68
kwhitefoot wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The radio is a completely separate sub system that is not affected by unlocking the boot loader of the main computer.

That's not always true. If it's possible to shave pennies off the BOM by having the radio driven by, or sharing memory with, the main CPU -- and it is possible -- there will be phones in the wild with that configuration.

While it is certainly possible, it isn't true for any modern phone with an app store.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#97

Post by sersi »

bombcar wrote: post #32
kleiba wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't own a smart TV, so this question is probably a bit naive - but what happens if you don't connect your smart TV to the internet?

It will work but it will have junk it really doesn't need complaining now and then, and be generally slow. Your best bet for a "non smart TV" is either a commercial/industrial one, or just use a monitor instead.

or a videoprojector. JVC videoprojectors are really great, extremely high image quality and are dumb :)

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#98

Post by foolmeonce »

bluGill wrote: post #46
cunidev wrote: post #40

Not even mentioning the hardware bits, I have been collaborating with postmarketOS for a while now, and believe that the main thing we need to make those devices longer-lasting would be an unlockable bootloader by law. This sounds so logical (why cannot I run, by voiding the warranty, any code I want on my machine, whatever it is?), yet apparently so hard to make openly illegal, since the problem is barely acknowledg…

You can't do that because someone (probably not you) will then unlock the phone and [insert something evil here - perhaps involving the radio]

Most phones secured bootloaders are hacked in less than 6 months if there is sufficient interest in the model. So if treatment of this as a huge security threat that makes other rights moot is valid then most of us should be able to return our improperly secured phones before their warranty is up.

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#99

Post by deadbunny »

dodobirdlord wrote: post #31
kleiba wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't own a smart TV, so this question is probably a bit naive - but what happens if you don't connect your smart TV to the internet?

Sometimes they will seek out nearby open WiFi networks to join. There’s concern that in coming years with the spread of 5G availability that smart TVs may start packaging a 5G modem and connecting to cell networks, bypassing the need to be connected to a WiFi network.

> Sometimes they will seek out nearby open WiFi networks to join

[Citation Needed]

Re: British right to repair law excludes smartphones and computers

#100

Post by rocqua »

Someone1234 wrote: post #38
emouryto wrote: post #16

Well, smartphones must be updated to include better spyware. And newer computers are also better locked down to allow better surveillance. So, the older ones can't break down fast enough! You don't want a repairable computer so creeps install, like, a Linux distro. You want disposable TPM machines with Windows 11 Home Edition and unstoppable "telemetry".

I feel like there's a large subset of people who don't understand what TPM does, so just assume the worst and hand wave about how it [somehow] causes [random bad thing]. In this case I guess TPM causes telemetry?

TPM used for secure boot, (hypothetically) used to block installing non-windows OS, means the owner is forced to using an OS that has telemetry.

That is the argument I suppose OP was making. The secure boot locking is hypothetical, but it is often feared. I get why, because it seems like something Microsoft would love to do.

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