‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect • Hacker News Board

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#91

Post by TheCanuckster » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

ProjectBarks wrote: post #62

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #42

In my experience at least talking to some younger people there is a clear dichotomy: despite all the talk about Gen Z being "digital natives", people new in their career are much hungrier to get back into the office because they don't yet have good career networks built up and they're eager for mentorship. It is older, or at least more established workers who are less keen on that. I don't think FAANGs will have any…

This is the exact sentiment I hold as well. I think the demographics of hacker news may be slightly swayed towards people who already have established networks and industry experience.

If this is the case, what are the forums people with less established networks and industry experience use?

It would seem prudent to be aware of these other "HNs".

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#92

Post by nly » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #69

alexdias wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m honestly perplexed what the FANGs are even thinking in being so aggressive about pushing an end to WFH. Yes, aggressive measures such as: -Allowing employees to apply to be permanent remote employees -Allowing 2 WFH days per week

> Allowing employees to apply to be permanent remote employees We'll see how this plays out, but I'm expecting this to be just a ploy to keep people from leaving right away and 95%+ requests to be remote will ultimately be denied.

The 2 day WFH thing will fade away as well.

My company has put those optional 2 days WFH to TLs to arrange amongst their teams, with the expectation that the whole team will have the same schedule.

Basically if your TL doesn't care or want you to WFH, or the team can't agree on days, you're done.

It'll be a major inconvenience and staff will ultimately not see the benefits of full WFH with 3, so it won't last.

I think there will be increased churn once the "wait and see" crowd clears

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#93

Post by sumtechguy » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

phreeza wrote: post #67

pc86 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not directly addressing your point, but how common is it for someone to be a FAANG developer - extremely well compensated and smart by all accounts - and not have other options? An argument like this makes sense for the random dev shops and non-tech company dev departments across the country. For many of those, the top 1 or 2 people are arguably good enough to switch over to FAANG or HFT or some other very highly com…

As a FAANG employee myself, I think your opinion of the average FAANG developer is perhaps a bit too generous.

What many miss is also these large companies are doing something very interesting in the labor market. They are starving the competition. They spend a bit extra on labor but they get a long term benefit of lower number of effective competitors. MS did this for years in the 90s. Apple/Atari/Sony/IBM did it in the 80s. Being in office ('free lunch', perks, etc) is part of that lock in. If people are at home then they are more likely to wander off and find another job as at that point the only real difference between jobs is the kind of thing you work on and money.

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#94

Post by tolbish » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #42

In my experience at least talking to some younger people there is a clear dichotomy: despite all the talk about Gen Z being "digital natives", people new in their career are much hungrier to get back into the office because they don't yet have good career networks built up and they're eager for mentorship. It is older, or at least more established workers who are less keen on that. I don't think FAANGs will have any…

Vets with 5+ years of specific subdomain experience within the company's ecosystem (along with experienced engineers who have experience from elsewhere) are much harder to replace.

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#95

Post by brightball » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #42

In my experience at least talking to some younger people there is a clear dichotomy: despite all the talk about Gen Z being "digital natives", people new in their career are much hungrier to get back into the office because they don't yet have good career networks built up and they're eager for mentorship. It is older, or at least more established workers who are less keen on that. I don't think FAANGs will have any…

Yea, this makes perfect sense to me. I had WFH as an option at my first job. After 3 weeks the cool perk wore off and I was in the office by choice everyday.

Now I have a family at home and life is much easier working out of the house.

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#96

Post by Bishizel » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #78

mdorazio wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can only speak from personal experience, but fwiw I'm currently consulting with 2 non-tech Fortune 500 companies. Both have implemented "hybrid" return to office policies where employees have to live within 100 miles of the office and be able to come in 1 day a week or 1 day a month depending on team. I've talked with executives in charge of large teams at both companies about this issue and so far it looks like th…

Job hunting right now. I know if I get two job offers and one is any form of WFH Hybrid (or a "you can probably work it out with your manager") and the other is 100% Remote, I'm taking the 100% remote position, unless the hybrid is like 2x the pay. Right now there's a lot of recruiters trying to sell me on various nebulous hybrid positions (sounds like the companies don't really know or have committed to anything jus…

I think a lot of people are doing this same thing (I know several personally). Getting 2 hrs back a day is amazing, and after having it for a year it is really hard to give up.

> I don't mind meeting up with other employees on the occasional fun team-building outing, but I really don't want to work in an office again.

I think this is probably where a lot of companies will settle out; wfh, but with monthly or quarterly workshops/meetups for teams.

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#97

Post by SpicyLemonZest » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

dcolkitt wrote: post #15

I’m honestly perplexed what the FANGs are even thinking in being so aggressive about pushing an end to WFH. Sure it could all work out fine for them. Maybe employees will grumble for a bit, then settle back into office life. But maybe it wont’t . There’s a very real possibility that you lose a non-negligible percent of your staff (disproportionately the most talented who have other options), handicap your ability to…

You're glossing too quickly over the "corporate culture" part. It's not about sustainability or gaming out disaster scenarios: they're pushing for an end to WFH because they try to cultivate a culture where people want to go to the office. (That's what all the amenities are for!)

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#98

Post by enoughalready » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:39 PM UTC

My work had plans to return to the office, but it's looking like the delta variant is going to allow us to kick the can down the road a bit longer. Looking at the UK numbers ramp up, despite 80% of their population being vaccinated, it seems likely the US will experience a bigger wave of infections.

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#99

Post by CountDrewku » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:39 PM UTC

PenguinCoder wrote: post #51

ziggus wrote: post #38

Fine, you want to WFH? Awesome, expect a pay cut. Part of a modern white-collar salary has some expectations built into it, like the fact that people need to be compensated for the inconveniences of leaving their homes and coming to the office and therefore having to pay for things like childcare, cars, clothing, parking, etc. Don't have those expenses anymore? Then why should I compensate you the same as if you did?…

Because you're still competing for me against local companies. You need to pay market rate at least for the area , for the work you want. Sure market rate in India is cheaper; but can they do what you actually need, in the time you need it? AT the time you need it ?

The entire remote worker in India thing is a fear mongering tactic. If it was so much cheaper and more efficient they would have all done it years ago.

Re: ‘Great Resignation’ gains steam as return-to-work plans take effect

#100

Post by RandomLensman » Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 2:40 PM UTC

I think WFH is just a symptom, but not the cause. The pandemic working situations exposed some truths about work for probably quite a few people: the rather pointlessness of many tasks was previously masked by camaraderie in the office or the new impressions from travelling.

So folks might want to do something else but might be difficult to actually find something that isn't the "same", really.