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A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

themarshallproject.org

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Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#91

10 years for non violent crime, that's barbaric.

American prison sentences tend to be higher than other developed nations, but 10 years is quite a bit just for burglary as he says. Florida is a 'three strikes' state so he must be a repeat offender (as in, in and out of prison).

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#92
post #53

What's his plan? Take it day by day? Watch his back? Also (infer no adversarial tone), he seems to imply that he needs to be prepared to defend himself against attack, ostensibly using his lingering Krav Maga skill and instincts. Does that violate his pacifism? Maybe "pacifist", in this context, should be understood to mean "unaffiliated with any gang".

I'm a pacifist and a martial artist. My first approach is de-escalation. That has failed, and I've been attacked by people, and still did not want to hurt those people. Nor will I allow people to simply beat me up. I've defended myself by deflecting and avoiding their attacks, using their momentum against them and whatnot; and when necessary, various holds or joint locks. I've also successfully fled situations where…

I'm curious: is it actually rational to use more harmful techniques against someone significantly larger than yourself, someone armed, or a group of people? It seems as likely as not to be perceived as an escalation, and in those types of situations an escalation is likelier to mean you get permanently injured or killed.

Of course, the best martial art is de-escalation and the next cross-country, but if you're cornered and there's an unbalanced distribution of force, you're kind of screwed regardless of what you do.

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#93
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm suggesting helping people before they interact with the police and courts.

What help would or could you give to an unrepentant rapist before they are captured by the police?

I'm suggesting a government, medical system, and community focused on helping people before they get to that point in their lives.

I'm focusing on the part I think we can all agree on and therefore is solvable.

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#94
post #66
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it intentionally racist to hold the perception that drug users and criminals are inherently violent?

It isn't intentionally racist to hold the belief...but the belief is an intentional construction to justify racist policing. Off the cuff and reducing a complicated discussion to somethign simple you can start here: https://medium.com/equityorg/reefer-madness-the-racist-roots... The early representations used to vilify marijuana were part of jim crow efforts to ensure racial hierarchies. They included representations…

Dude, it's been a hundred years. Times change.

Nobody cares about weed anymore for the most part.

Crack is mostly a non issue as that epidemic has already ran its course.

Perceptions of coke are relegated to jokes about white collar professionals and crazy parties.

Heroin and meth are the two drugs people really look down on these days and they're stereotypical white people drugs.

Attempts to cast everyone who wants some sort of stricter drug enforcement as closet racists is naive at best. And this is coming from someone who thinks meth should be available at Walmart just like caffeine pills.

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#95
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>10 years for a non violent burglary. There are two common ways to get a crazy prison sentence. Drug and/or gun possession often acts as a multiplier on sentencing guidelines for whatever the underlying crime is. Multiple contacts with the system (three strikes laws and parole/probation violations) tend to have compounding sentences so screwing up on parole or probation can net you an additional sentence than in addi…

> three strikes laws The three-strikes law is pure abomination, I've first learned about it watching "Oz" (the TV series) in the early 2000s, couldn't believe that that was real (I don't live in the States). 15 years have passed and there is still no real conversation about abolishing it.

>The three-strikes law is pure abomination

Why? I don't have a well-formed opinion on this type of policy but there is a balance between prioritizing justice for victims and rights of victimizers. Behind every single strike are innocent people who have been hurt by the individual and at some point, you have to take steps to protect them from someone who just doesn't want to stop.

You also can't take away all agency from that individual. Those strikes are collected through many years and multiple prison sentences - at that point, it's a decision to continue.

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#96
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as it is more profitable to sell drugs illegally they will continually be sold and trafficked illegally no matter the letter of the law. Even marijuana is grown and trafficked by the cartel in CA, because of the onerous licensing process and the heavy taxation imposed by the state and local governments make it more profitable to operate on the black market. https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-10-28/…

To a point, sure: Tobacco and alcohol are still sold illegally. But most folks buy it from the stores, and if they aren't, adjustments need to be made. Taxation isn't generally the issue (as alcohol & tobacco are taxed) as long as it is easy to purchase and reasonably priced. The other issue is that there are conflicts between state and federal law. Not being able to bank easily is a major hurdle, and these sorts of…

And that's the caveat. The black market still outweighs the legal market because it is difficult to purchase because of the difficulty in opening a legitimate dispensary, and it isn't reasonably priced with a 30% upcharge for taxes. right off the bat the illegal dispensary is 30% cheaper, and that makes a bigger difference in the MJ market where the base cost of the product is much higher than for a $16 bottle of liquor. Even with alcohol and tobacco it is very typical for people living near a state border to buy their product on the side with the more favorable taxes, routinely done even.

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#97
post #14
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree there's a lot to be done to reduce the number of prisoners. But at the end of the day, what do you do about members of society who greatly harm others? (murder, rape, etc)? I can't think of any effective solutions which aren't prison, death penalty, or prison-disguised-as-something-else (like a hospital). Maybe exile? What's your philosophy in those cases?

The way I see this is, prison should not be taken lightly. The cavalier attitude of simply shoving addicts into prison glosses over the gravity of using this option. There are appropriate use cases for prison, and violence in prison will be inevitable. The very least we can do is take that more seriously, and stop shoving addicts into the same place as violent murderers.

But are you suggesting addicts can commit crimes to finance their addiction in impunity?

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#99
post #16
post #11

One horror is the length of sentence - 10 years for a non violent burglary.

I agree, it's crazy to take away ~1/7th of someone's life - during their most productive years - for theft. Are we to believe that it takes 10 years to "fix" someone of their theft problem? Did it take 10 years for them to form it? I expect in most cases the theft problem would go away at the same time as the drug problem the writer explains they had.

I assume the first shorter sentences were meant to “fix” it. When they obviously didn’t the objective switches to protecting society.

Re: A pacifist's plan to survive the violent world of prison

#100

10 years for non violent crime, that's barbaric.

American prison sentences tend to be higher than other developed nations, but 10 years is quite a bit just for burglary as he says. Florida is a 'three strikes' state so he must be a repeat offender (as in, in and out of prison).

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