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Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

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Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#91

Post by bsima »

Cytobit wrote: post #60
drieddust wrote: post #26

Wim hof have achieved great things practising the ancient practice of pranayama which is actually a part of yoga. Yet he presents it as if he "discovered" it. This is pure intellectual dishonesty. Yoga's actual name is ashtanga yoga which means it has eight limbs[1]. Contrary to popular belief Yoga is not about just twisting your body into weird poses. That aspect is called ASANA and what Wim Hof claims as his discov…

> That aspect is called ASANA and what Wim Hof claims as his discovery is called pranayama which is a fully developed science of breath control practices by Sadhus and monks for centuries. I'm curious why you called it a "science". It would be very interesting to see yoga developed with a scientific approach.

It is "a science" insofar as it draws relations between observed phenomenon. Do not confuse this with "the scientific method" which is a particular technique of drawing these relations that has a particular history in the Western world.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#92

Post by beervirus »

thotsBgone wrote: post #71
beervirus wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that we can exert conscious control over an unexpected part of our bodies doesn’t really provide evidence for astral projection or whatever.

I think there is a distinction to be made between your consciousness leaving your body, and the feeling that your consciousness has left your body. One is clearly impossible, but the other, while less impressive, would still be a transformative experience.

This is the comment I was responding to:

> What are the repercussions of that? Does that imply, for instance, bending spoons with our mind could be a thing? I mean, if our identity extends beyond this flesh and can be aligned with the will of the universe, then maybe that's a thing. Maybe that's a thought we can entertain.

It doesn't seem to be about imagining that we can bend spoons with our minds.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#94

Post by jb1991 »

athenot wrote: post #11

Breathing techniques AND exposure to cold . From the article: ii) During the training, subjects voluntarily exposed themselves to cold in several ways: standing in the snow barefoot for up to 30 min and lying bare chested in the snow for 20 min; daily dipping/swimming in ice-cold water (0–1 °C) for up to several minutes (including complete submersions); and hiking up a snowy mountain (elevation: 1,590 m) bare chested…

> standing in the snow barefoot for up to 30 min and lying bare chested in the snow for 20 min; daily dipping/swimming in ice-cold water (0–1 °C) for up to several minutes (including complete submersions); and hiking up a snowy mountain (elevation: 1,590 m) bare chested, wearing nothing but shorts and shoes at temperatures ranging from −5 to −12 °C

These tasks sound so extraordinary to me, to the point where it is hard for me to believe there are not negative consequences. I mean, frostbite is a real thing. What about hypothermia? It seems there are serious risks to just going out and doing these things. I'm fascinated by Wim Hof but it seems the risks are not getting enough attention, unless the risks don't really exist, in which case there are a lot of myths out there.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#95

Post by jb1991 »

steve_adams_86 wrote: post #47
jasonshen wrote: post #2

Wim Hof "Iceman" definitely gives me "cult leader" vibes but cool to see this research get published in a very reputable scientific journal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VaMjhwFE1Zw

I think the cult vibe might come from internet sensationalism. He seems fine. He says some weird unscientific stuff, but overall I think he believes in what he’s doing with a good nature about it, and I don’t see how harm can come from what he encourages. He has a very positive message. One thing that compelled me to look into it was how little he seems to want money for his efforts. I mean, he makes money off of his…

> I don’t see how harm can come from what he encourages

I left this comment earlier because it seems like there are genuine risks to this sort of thing, but I must be wrong since no one is highlighting them:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24809114

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#96

Post by steve_adams_86 »

jb1991 wrote: post #94
athenot wrote: post #11

Breathing techniques AND exposure to cold . From the article: ii) During the training, subjects voluntarily exposed themselves to cold in several ways: standing in the snow barefoot for up to 30 min and lying bare chested in the snow for 20 min; daily dipping/swimming in ice-cold water (0–1 °C) for up to several minutes (including complete submersions); and hiking up a snowy mountain (elevation: 1,590 m) bare chested…

> standing in the snow barefoot for up to 30 min and lying bare chested in the snow for 20 min; daily dipping/swimming in ice-cold water (0–1 °C) for up to several minutes (including complete submersions); and hiking up a snowy mountain (elevation: 1,590 m) bare chested, wearing nothing but shorts and shoes at temperatures ranging from −5 to −12 °C These tasks sound so extraordinary to me, to the point where it is ha…

I can see the risk, I agree. I’d compare it to running a marathon though. Not many people’s bodies will allow them to actually endure and accomplish this without them quitting and going somewhere warm. I suppose someone could go into the cold without preparing properly, for sure.

There are people who do his breathing technique and breath hold until they pass out too. Again, this is usually not damaging (from what I’ve read) if you’re somewhere safe, but you’re right that people miss the point and end up doing potentially dangerous things as a result.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#97

Post by Arech »

lunchladydoris wrote: post #7

I see the article was published in 2014. Does anyone know if much more has come out of this since then?

I've just investigated this - yes, there are more papers published. Just google to Wim Hof's site and check a page about science (I'm not sure I should post the link). There's an chronological list at the end of the page. Most of papers are open access, but there's one blocked, so Sci-Hub would help as always.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#98

Post by Arech »

chombier wrote: post #8

For those wondering about the "breathing technique", figure 2 has a link to a movie.

It's very incomplete actually... I've just found this video while navigating through Wim Hof's site - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tybOi4hjZFQ It's quite easy to do, btw... I'll try it for some days and see how it going to go...

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#99

Post by leoh »

parliament32 wrote: post #36
leoh wrote: post #30

I've been using the mobile device made by Heartmath lately — https://store.heartmath.com/tech/ . It looks at HRV (heart rate variability) and gives you a realtime plot, thereby offering visual feedback about how my breathing is affecting how steady the time between heartbeats is. Hearthmath calls low HRV "coherence" and getting into a lower HRV state (i.e. via regular, smooth breathing; maybe 1 in/out breath each ~10…

I think you have it backwards, you want a higher HRV, not lower. A higher HRV is healthier. Being in a calm state will have higher HRV, being stressed will result in a lower HRV. Higher HRV is associated with reduced morbidity and mortality, and improved psychological well-being and quality of life. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5882295/ https://www.firstbeat.com/en/science-and-physiology/heart-ra...

Thanks! You're totally right.

Re: Wim Hof breathing technique can modulate immune response to pathogens (2014)

#100

Post by throw1234651234 »

loceng wrote: post #78
throw1234651234 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both do nothing whatsoever for me.

Do you consider yourself healthy overall? Health has such a wide spectrum, likewise does a person's self-awareness and orienting oneself when you only subjectively have your previous states to base your current health off of - so it's only when you become healthier that you realize you weren't so healthy before.

I maybe understand your question - when I lose fitness, I am not aware of lost fitness unless I try to lift a heavy thing again or run distance, at which point it becomes clear. In that vein, I had decent cardio at some point, so that might be part of why the breathing techniques don't really add much to it.

As far as meditation - it's very hard to draw a mental baseline. The only sort-of scientific, sort-of reliable way I know is measuring your working memory.

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