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How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

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Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#91

Post by dccoolgai »

Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #73
fermienrico wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment is 28 mins old and there are so many anti-China comments in this thread that are downvoted into grayness. Something is definitely odd. This is an American forum, 7:27am on Saturday morning.

I assure you, any high-traffic website with commentary that touches on economic or geostrategic interests of China will have wumao on the prowl. I have never seen posts get such quick and consistent downvoting as those that deal with China in a critical manner.

Yeah, this is a big problem. I just searched "uighur" on comments... Some pretty appalling stuff, including stuff that seems to justify their genocide by accusing them of terrorism. Clearly something is wrong. Hopefully @dang will look at this at some point. We make a sport of busting FBs chops over policing disinfo, etc. And it looks like there are brazen actors on HN doing worse and we're ignoring it.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#92

Post by shalmanese »

fermienrico wrote: post #70
Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wumao.

Your comment is 28 mins old and there are so many anti-China comments in this thread that are downvoted into grayness. Something is definitely odd. This is an American forum, 7:27am on Saturday morning.

Because it's an intellectually lazy assertion that's never made with any sort of backing evidence and forstalls debate by preemptively painting any opinion you don't agree with as the work of paid shills.

China sending wumao onto Hacker News would go against the vast majority of precedent we've been able to establish about Chinese disinformation campaigns. Overwhelmingly, active Chinese disinformation is produced in Chinese for a ethnic Chinese overseas audience with English only ever being provided as an afterthought.

The Chinese strategy for shaping English debate about China has always involved economic punishment for powerful entities that broadcast "unacceptable" opinions like the NBA with HK or US airlines labelling Taiwan as a country on their websites. However, such pressures scale directly to the amount of financial stakes an entity has in China which means it has effectively no power in anonymous social forums.

This can be evidenced by issues such as Hong Kong where, not only was Western opinion not receptive to the Chinese arguments on the issue, there wasn't even any form of broad awareness of what the Chinese arguments even were. To the extent that the Chinese narrative even made it over to the West (such as claims that the protestors were being paid by the CIA), they were overwhelmingly conveyed via Western media that only described them in order to debunk them.

Like so much other disinformation about China, the whole wumao conspiracy is a bunch of lazy nonsense that is spewed by people with no real knowledge of China nor a desire for accuracy and thus gets reflexively downvoted on HN by people who are sick of lazy, bad arguments made against China when there are so many legitimate, good arguments that fail to be made because they don't fit neatly into a narrative.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#93

Post by true_religion »

zozbot234 wrote: post #89
rbecker wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this context, IP includes trade secrets, industry know-how, and human expertise. Strip away the IP, and only inventory and manual labor is left.

> IP includes trade secrets, industry know-how, and human expertise These are the hardest kinds of IP to reproduce or "steal", though. I can believe that direct infringement of formal IP rights might be an issue, but this sort of more 'tacit' knowledge is a different ballpark.

Trade secrets and human expertise are incredibly easy to steal, but in the US at least trade secrets are protected by law unless explicitly disclosed to the public and human expertise is constrained by non compete agreements.

On the other hand, for a country, any company operating within its boarders using is ripe for exploitation. Unless a foreign company uses 100% foreign workers, and eschews all government inspections, then the knowledge is already exposed to your citizens.

With the way CCP policy is, if a trade secret is exposed to anyone on China, it’s effectively lost completely since the government can directly disclose it to who ever they wish.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#94

Post by croutonwagon »

dwd wrote: post #33
croutonwagon wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Easy bypass is to run it through a url shortener, and then outline.com. Works for NYT as well, and most others.

NYT can be bypassed using Reader View, but the WSJ seems to be able to disable it.

Sometimes. I find it can be hit and miss. Depending on how many articles ive read....er loaded.

Outline trick works for a lot. Even sites like financial times etc

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#95

Post by true_religion »

secondcoming wrote: post #17
jacquesm wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forbidding that practice will simply mean that you won't be doing any more business in China. Which is fine with me. It's just that CEOs that see a virgin population of over a billion consumers for their widgets can't help themselves and will agree to just about anything to be able to tap that market before their competition does.

The agreement needs to be reciprocal. China should have to jump through the same hoops if it wants to do business in the US, UK, Australia, etc And not just for doing business either, things like home ownership too. If I cannot buy a house in China (not that I'd want to pay for a Chinese house that'll last 5 years max) because I'm not Chinese then they should not be allowed buy in my country either. Vancouver, Toront…

I don’t think people’s outrage about political topics is fake.

If I came out I strong support the Uyghurs re-education camps, would those outraged by that be faking it simply because I have zero influence in the CCP?

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#96

Post by [deleted] »

magicsmoke wrote: post #88
alloai wrote: post #64

There are two sides of the story, there is a Chinese version saying that there are a lots of frauds here. Car making is a capital burning business, you just can not do it without the wealth like elon musk. It's kind of a venture investment here, there were so many car investment in the past few years, when there were investment bubbles, but now, the bubble is gone.

I've read in a paper somewhere that a big part of why Chinese auto manufacturers aren't as successful as Japanese or Korean ones is because they're too tied to the local government to fail. Each province in China has their own local auto company connected to the provincial government, resulting in a lot of duplicated effort and inefficiency. Japan and Korea had a lot of indigenous auto makers when they first started…

[deleted]

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#97

Post by true_religion »

kiba wrote: post #57
mattmanser wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you need to read up on your history. Here's an easy place to start. https://www.google.com/search?q=america+stole+britain+intell... There's plenty of documented evidence that America illegally stole tons of IP, often paid for by the state no less, otherwise known as industrial espionage. I'm sure they did it to all the European powers of the time too, probably plenty of examples of stolen tech from Spain, the…

Too much effort? America llegally stole tons of IP, otherwise known as industrial espionage. What about it? That was over a century ago. It still doesn't make China's industrial espionage ethical or right.

From the US point of view, it was freeing knowledge from the hands of backwards aristocrats, who for too long had lived on the backs of the common classes. The US felt it needed to be on par with Europe or risk having itself reconquered.

From the Chinese point of view, it is freeing knowledge from imperialist powers that previously conspired to divide its country, drug its populace with opium, set up rape camps for the mere “comfort” their soldiers. It feels that it must be on par with these counties or risk having atrocity after atrocity revisited upon it.

No one feels they are evil, and even when you “cheat” it’s always because you were cheated first.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#98

Post by true_religion »

fermienrico wrote: post #70
Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wumao.

Your comment is 28 mins old and there are so many anti-China comments in this thread that are downvoted into grayness. Something is definitely odd. This is an American forum, 7:27am on Saturday morning.

It’s not 7:30 am everywhere in America. There is an East coast.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#99

Post by cheez »

zozbot234 wrote: post #85
cheez wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Knowledge creation and discovery is the engine of economies today. You might as well say "why don't you let everyone live in your house for free" People who create need to be able to benefit from that creation.

Knowledge creation and discovery always builds on previously discovered and created knowledge. There are many ways of benefiting from this activity, even more so without a formal IP-based business strategy.

Please, describe something sustainable that doesn't involve keeping it secret.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#100

Post by amaccuish »

fermienrico wrote: post #70
Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wumao.

Your comment is 28 mins old and there are so many anti-China comments in this thread that are downvoted into grayness. Something is definitely odd. This is an American forum, 7:27am on Saturday morning.

> This is an American forum, 7:27am on Saturday morning.

Ah yes, Europe and several other continents don't exist. And I forgot that HN is geoblocked in every other country...

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