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TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

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91–100 of 151 posts

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the Chinese cyber threat is incredibly real. The United States should be playing hard ball. The US TikTok systems are compromised by Chinese spammers already.

If the threat of Tiktok gathering data is so real, then isn't a much better solution, to pressure Google and Apple into improving their security models? That way, nobody can spy on your phone anymore. Or do you think Tiktok is the only and last threat there will ever exist? But nobody's talking about actual solutions. All this looks more like a witch hunt to me.

I don't think the key data that TikTok is gathering is anything you can really block on your phone. It doesn't ask for your phone number, it doesn't ask contacts, it doesn't ask for access to your messages. Instead, it looks for trends, it looks at who you are.

I (18 years old) have used TikTok for about 2 months, before deleting it because it simply got too addictive. In that time it learned what my favourite games are, what shows I watched as a child, my political views, my eating preferences, my technology preferences. The list goes on. While I'm not sure how much of this is saved in a black box and only known by the algorithm and how much they can extract, I'd argue that this is many times more valuable for China that my personal phone.

Furthermore the power to influence the algorithm, subtle and slightly of course, may slowly change the minds of literal millions of teens.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#92
I'm no fan of TikTok, but in general the US president doesn't get to tell US companies what to buy, and he doesn't get to tell US persons what internet sites they can or cannot visit. (Yes, I realize it does happen e.g. for gambling sites, but it's generally a game of whack-a-mole for the government because there is no Great Firewall of the US.) If ByteDance just told Trump to go to hell, what specific legal and technical actions could he take to stop Americans from using TikTok?

I'm worried about precedent here, and whether this is just a pretext for creating a GFoUS.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#93
post #88
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Nice rapidly-growing foreign service you have there. It would be a shame if we called it a ‘national security risk’ and made you sell it to us for pennies on the dime!”

China has blocked almost every major US internet company. Crying that Tik Tok is being forced into a sale is a bit rich. National Security concerns aside, there's a legitimate argument that the West should be banning every service that comes out of China until they open up their market.

Or we could try to be the country with better morals than China instead of posturing as one.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#94

I'm no fan of TikTok, but in general the US president doesn't get to tell US companies what to buy, and he doesn't get to tell US persons what internet sites they can or cannot visit. (Yes, I realize it does happen e.g. for gambling sites, but it's generally a game of whack-a-mole for the government because there is no Great Firewall of the US.) If ByteDance just told Trump to go to hell, what specific legal and tech…

Sorry, a GFoUS?

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#95
post #3

Where is EU in this embarrassment? Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company take over your business? And by the way. We would like a cut. And would the US still being able to say "national security" if it was fully owned by German business running on servers in some Swiss mountain?

One of the reasons the US can do this is because this is unwinding the Musical.ly deal. The EU certainly has the ability to block an acquisition of an EU company by a US megacap.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#96
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the threat of Tiktok gathering data is so real, then isn't a much better solution, to pressure Google and Apple into improving their security models? That way, nobody can spy on your phone anymore. Or do you think Tiktok is the only and last threat there will ever exist? But nobody's talking about actual solutions. All this looks more like a witch hunt to me.

I don't think the key data that TikTok is gathering is anything you can really block on your phone. It doesn't ask for your phone number, it doesn't ask contacts, it doesn't ask for access to your messages. Instead, it looks for trends, it looks at who you are. I (18 years old) have used TikTok for about 2 months, before deleting it because it simply got too addictive. In that time it learned what my favourite games…

There is a solution even to that. That's what the Microsoft sale is all about. That's why Bytedance proposed to sell ALL shares of their US branch. Replace the entire US branch staff with US employees. Vet every line of code. Don't send any data to China. This is the ultimate solution.

And yet nobody seems to be interested in this solution. People are still cooking up new reasons to ban Tiktok. Or ignoring the existence of this solution altogether.

Why do you think that might be? I suspect it's because the issue is more emotional and fear-based than rational. People are falling for the propaganda.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#97

It continues to be damning that the leadership of Microsoft did not buy Vine [1] from Twitter in 2017 for pennies on the dollar before Vine was shutdown. Vine was very popular, and a lot of people were very disappointed when it was shutdown back when Twitter was bleeding a lot cash. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vine_(service)

TikToc is basicaly Vine2.0 and will go down just like Vine and YikYak already did. The reason behind MS wanting to acquire TT we will never know. I have a feeling the national sec. implications arent exactly what we are saying they are.

Neither Vine nor YikYak was doing $3B in profit/year. TikTok is likely here to stay.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#98
post #3

Where is EU in this embarrassment? Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company take over your business? And by the way. We would like a cut. And would the US still being able to say "national security" if it was fully owned by German business running on servers in some Swiss mountain?

Because the Chinese cyber threat is incredibly real. The United States should be playing hard ball. The US TikTok systems are compromised by Chinese spammers already.

The situation that we have is that the only person who actually has the willpower to stand up to China (Trump) is simultaneously too idiotic and too self-centered to effectively do so.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#99

I'm no fan of TikTok, but in general the US president doesn't get to tell US companies what to buy, and he doesn't get to tell US persons what internet sites they can or cannot visit. (Yes, I realize it does happen e.g. for gambling sites, but it's generally a game of whack-a-mole for the government because there is no Great Firewall of the US.) If ByteDance just told Trump to go to hell, what specific legal and tech…

The US president can probably compel Apple and Google to remove Tiktok from their app stores. Tiktok can appeal that action to the US court system and the US legislature, but those appeals would probably go nowhere.

So a technically inclined Android user or a user of a jailbroken iOS device can probably continue to use Tiktok, with effort, but will have much fewer people to interact with using the service.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#100
post #99

I'm no fan of TikTok, but in general the US president doesn't get to tell US companies what to buy, and he doesn't get to tell US persons what internet sites they can or cannot visit. (Yes, I realize it does happen e.g. for gambling sites, but it's generally a game of whack-a-mole for the government because there is no Great Firewall of the US.) If ByteDance just told Trump to go to hell, what specific legal and tech…

The US president can probably compel Apple and Google to remove Tiktok from their app stores. Tiktok can appeal that action to the US court system and the US legislature, but those appeals would probably go nowhere. So a technically inclined Android user or a user of a jailbroken iOS device can probably continue to use Tiktok, with effort, but will have much fewer people to interact with using the service.

If the president can't compel Apple/Google to install backdoors, he can't compel them to remove TikTok.
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