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How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

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Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#91
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're both necessary for change, it's just often that direct action forces policy

A policy or law that enforces a certain behavior that contradicts culture, would, by definition be undemocratic. A policy or law that enforces a certain behavior that is already present as a strong cultural norm, would be redundant.

There is an extremely strong cultural and behavioral norm against murder. I do not find laws against it to be redundant.

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#92
What are some actual laws we can pass from this situation?

I was thinking at the very least to get a citizen right where you can request to have any encounter with the police recorded.

‘Officer I request my right to have this encounter recorded’.

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not an American. Can you share one or two reforms that you would like implemented. It is hard to grasp what is really going on from a distance.

Significantly expanding police training, and greater coverage of topics such as nonviolent de-escalation, community outreach, implicit bias training, and how to work with mentally ill individuals. Greater accountability through body cam programs, and community oversight boards for police departments everywhere. De-militarization of police, because right now, the police can legally buy surplus military gear and use it…

I'm generally on board with everything you've said, but

>like to see most beat cops completely disarmed

seems absolutely crazy to me as long as the general public has such easy access to guns.

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do not use violence in a democratic protest. To use it is effective acknowledgement that you either want to destroy the democracy or do not believe that it actually exists on the moment.

The American revolution was a violent protest.

Yes, and the people participating on it were pretty sure they weren't living in a democracy.

I imagine that many people on those current protests believe they aren't in one either (or, at least, if one exists they are cast out of it). I'm in no position to judge if they are right, but on the case they are not, violence is no means to do a democratic protest.

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cannot condone violence nor encourage it, but you have to admit that the first few protests and property damage drastically influenced the quick arrest of an officer that may not have been arrested or even fired if it didn't happen. The non-violent protests of Colin Kaepernick were mocked and used to rally the other side and just weren't effective. The problem here is not the violence, but a policing system that is…

Not an American. Can you share one or two reforms that you would like implemented. It is hard to grasp what is really going on from a distance.

Other replies have some useful ideas, but I think it's important to strike right at the heart of the issue: lack of accountability and redress.

Something _like_: make police leadership legally accountable for the actions of their officers. I say something _like_ this because it's in the right direction, but probably not the exact solution necessary. Another similar approach is something _like_ forbidding police unions or otherwise completely neuter them [with respect to Officer's actions].

Ideas like community service are good, but I think it's important to have clarity of approach (drop racism as the driving force and focus on accountability) and efficacy (make real changes).

This issue is very murky even to Americans, but everyone will say they know what the problem is or they will deny that there is a problem. If their description of the problem aligns with predictable political leanings, they're likely taking an emotionally driven perspective.

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#97
post #35

"I’ve heard some suggest that the recurrent problem of racial bias in our criminal justice system proves that only protests and direct action can bring about change, and that voting and participation in electoral politics is a waste of time. I couldn’t disagree more. The point of protest is to raise public awareness... But eventually, aspirations have to be translated into specific laws and institutional practices —…

> Voting and democracy should not become a device to placate the dissatisfied masses into silence, make them lineup for ballot, to choose a lesser evil who, in most likelihood, will turn out to be a egotistical power-seeker. What else should you expect when people are limited to only two political parties? It could be worse with only one political party.

I think the real problem is that those two political parties represent factions of the population with incompatible values.

We don't need more political parties, we need solutions to manage the incompatibility.

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#98
post #35

"I’ve heard some suggest that the recurrent problem of racial bias in our criminal justice system proves that only protests and direct action can bring about change, and that voting and participation in electoral politics is a waste of time. I couldn’t disagree more. The point of protest is to raise public awareness... But eventually, aspirations have to be translated into specific laws and institutional practices —…

I would agree with you except basically everyone was on the same side as soon as the video was released. Everyone, right, left, and center agreed there was a serious problem. So what are we raising awareness about?

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#99

"Yes we can" warmed up all-over again. Why is this on HN?

Please don’t create new accounts just to give these type of comments. If you don’t like the post then don’t upvote it and move along.

If you don't like a comment, please downvote it and move on. HN is not meta and you are not the comment police.

Re: How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Voting and democracy should not become a device to placate the dissatisfied masses into silence, make them lineup for ballot, to choose a lesser evil who, in most likelihood, will turn out to be a egotistical power-seeker. What else should you expect when people are limited to only two political parties? It could be worse with only one political party.

I think the real problem is that those two political parties represent factions of the population with incompatible values. We don't need more political parties, we need solutions to manage the incompatibility.

There was nothing incompatible about our values regarding what we saw in that video. The idea that there was a political divide about this incident is a myth. Even the openly racist people I know were saying it was fucked up.
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