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Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

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Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#91

Post by AndrewKemendo »

mindblownlazy wrote: post #90
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of my work weeks clock in around 50-60 hours regularly. It's pretty simple how this happens. It's meetings all day and then once meetings are over it's email, documents, admin paperwork, training etc... Here's an example of just last Thursday which was busy but was at least not double booked and had some times I could stop and go to the bathroom, I also wasn't traveling this day which was good: 8-12 - US Senate…

I keep seeing this but why do non-creatives count dinner, commuting and exercise as work? (You don't do all these but you put dinner there) As a creative I find it hard to justify that, sure I did talk about work during lunch with a coworker or an ex coworker or friend but damn I was just enjoying my pork chops, that's not work!!!

I don't count dinner as work, that was just my whole schedule.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#92

Post by vonseel »

whatshisface wrote: post #68
penagwin wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm diagnosed with ADD and have a prescription for Ritalin/Concerta. I'm a full time programmer, and I think my sustainable "real work and focus" time is max 6 hours. Today looks more like 4. A higher dose does not increase that time, at least for me. I'm curious how those without add/adhd are affected.

I've heard from many people that if you're legitimately on the drug the experience is totally different than if you're taking it without a brain chemistry that needs it i.e. as a study drug. I wonder if that means that people who have ADHD could possibly have different or fewer side-effects than people without, if the two groups respond so differently. Are there any large scale studies about the long term health impl…

I’m on Adderall for ~12 years but I disagree. Although I agree with the previous commenter, I don’t think it extends my “normal” productive max. Sure, occasionally I can feel productive for an extended stretch, but usually I feel wiped out after 4-6 hours of any real effort. I just had an hour long phone call and that alone was tiring..

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#93

Post by tmpz22 »

derision wrote: post #50
whoopsthereis wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or loads of caffeine to the point it is questionable?

I would argue one cup of coffee a day every single day is questionable. We shouldn't be drugging ourselves just to reach some arbitrary deadlines

I think caffeine is often used for motivation during mundane tasks. Imagine working on a tedious engineering assignment like writing unit tests for a CRUD app. Over a few years it becomes a necessary lever, and at that point it is pretty close to an addiction.

Amount of caffeine consumed by a team may be an interesting proxy for how motivated employees are at a company (a small amount indicates high motivation, a medium amount indicates low motivation, and a high amount indicates either a severe lack of motivation or a high level of motivation).

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#94

Post by natalyarostova »

faitswulff wrote: post #80
Aunche wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of surgeons have 80 hour workweeks. This is especially common is smaller hospitals in rural areas. It's not all surgery, but they're definitely not sitting at their desks and doing nothing. Before regulations, it was not uncommon for some doctors to work over 100 hours because they were in such high demand.

This schedule was established by a literal drug addict (cocaine and morphine) named William Halsted, not due to high demand.

And it’s since been reviewed and maintained due to the continual finding that continuity of care is so important to health outcomes that it makes up for exhaustion.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#95

Post by AndrewKemendo »

tmpz22 wrote: post #85
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of my work weeks clock in around 50-60 hours regularly. It's pretty simple how this happens. It's meetings all day and then once meetings are over it's email, documents, admin paperwork, training etc... Here's an example of just last Thursday which was busy but was at least not double booked and had some times I could stop and go to the bathroom, I also wasn't traveling this day which was good: 8-12 - US Senate…

Do you ever feel stressed, anxious, or trapped, with such a packed schedule? And do you ever feel regret over the value you produce due to the fact that you're stretched in so many directions? My career - I think - is heading in the same direction (though still early) and I have a severe problem internalizing every little thing and its relative yield to the business. Thankfully I only manage 3 people at a small compa…

Nope, I'm at my best in days like this. I feel immensely grateful I was given the opportunity and responsibility to lead and want other people to understand how great (in many senses of the term) that responsibility is.

The days where we deep dive infrastructure problems or try and get at organizational technical problems are my favorite, but those are even longer days.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#96

Post by gremlinsinc »

1st week of December, I did 87 hours clocked on clockify for clients. I turn clock off when I go to the bathroom, or get distracted on HN/Reddit. It's only on while I'm coding.

But I get burnt out fast when on a schedule like that, and knew I'd have some downtime with holidays and need to fill up on work to pay bills in January. Definitely couldn't sustain hours like that unless I was CEO and it was my baby then I'd be more apt to just keep going because it's a passion project.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#97

Post by zarkov99 »

NathanKP wrote: post #74
mikeg8 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>How anyone can say this with a straight face blows my mind Elon is the only person to ever start four 1bn+ companies (paypal, tesla, SpaceX, Solarcity). He has/is driving innovation across multiple industries on a time scale that I don't think any of the people you mentioned can really touch, not to mention hyperloop and the Boring Company. Its not even debatable IMO.

I'd still say that John Rockefeller is more impressive. Adjusted for inflation John Rockefeller's company Standard Oil was worth over $1 trillion. Or Johan van Oldenbarnevelt, the guy who started the Dutch East India company, which adjusted for inflation was worth over $8.2 trillion. Modern companies have nothing on what entrepreneurs did in the past and how much money they made. It doesn't matter how many markets El…

Well sure, but these guys did not make that much money because they were better CEO's, they benefited from the context of the times. What Musk has done with Tesla and SpaceX, simultaneously is absolutely mind blowing and it is hard to imagine anyone topping that, like ever. He created incredibly successful companies in some of the most competitive, most capital intensive, most research driven businesses that exist. It is amazing to me the man is not given his proper due. What he did was super-human and, in the long, could actually put a dent in the Universe.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#98

Post by jcims »

mindblownlazy wrote: post #90
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of my work weeks clock in around 50-60 hours regularly. It's pretty simple how this happens. It's meetings all day and then once meetings are over it's email, documents, admin paperwork, training etc... Here's an example of just last Thursday which was busy but was at least not double booked and had some times I could stop and go to the bathroom, I also wasn't traveling this day which was good: 8-12 - US Senate…

I keep seeing this but why do non-creatives count dinner, commuting and exercise as work? (You don't do all these but you put dinner there) As a creative I find it hard to justify that, sure I did talk about work during lunch with a coworker or an ex coworker or friend but damn I was just enjoying my pork chops, that's not work!!!

Why do we culturally accept the distinction 'creatives' and 'non-creatives'. It's gross.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#99

Post by randycupertino »

carbocation wrote: post #48
bwb wrote: post #28

I don't believe anyone really does 80 hours. I just don't think it is possible and I don't think you can call sitting at a desk doing nothing "work". I've done 60 hours during intense periods just fine... but it was only effective because of the nature of the work I was doing at the time. And, I usually took a break down the road to compensate. In no way was it even 50% creative work. 4 to 6 creative hours seems righ…

I did a few years of 80 hours, but that was as a medical resident / fellow. There is a lot of creativity in medicine (especially thinking adversarially to try to reduce premature closure on a diagnosis), but even then certainly we’re not being creative for all 80 hours a week.

Agree with this. Also in medicine we can work 12hr or 24hr shifts which imo helps "stack" together more hours so it's easier to hit larger work weeks.

As an EMT some of our crew worked 1 48hr shift and then later in the week 1 24hr shift. They got paid so little ($9.25 an hour back then!) that was the only way to survive in the Bay Area was to stack your shifts and then hit time and a half after 40hrs and double time for the last 20 hrs.

I had a preceptor who worked those shifts and I had to work her schedule while she was evaluating me. It was horrific. The 48s were brutal and I was wrecked later in the week when it came time to do the 24. Those months went by in a blur and it was basically hell to get through it.

When I advanced and got to set my own schedule I just worked 1 24hr and 1 12hr and life was great. Got to do chores and errands and long hiking trips on my days off, had enough time to travel and enjoy my hobbies.

Left EMS to more of an office job because I needed to make more $$, but I miss the patients, the camaraderie, and being out in the field.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#100

Post by anon73044 »

NathanKP wrote: post #74
mikeg8 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>How anyone can say this with a straight face blows my mind Elon is the only person to ever start four 1bn+ companies (paypal, tesla, SpaceX, Solarcity). He has/is driving innovation across multiple industries on a time scale that I don't think any of the people you mentioned can really touch, not to mention hyperloop and the Boring Company. Its not even debatable IMO.

I'd still say that John Rockefeller is more impressive. Adjusted for inflation John Rockefeller's company Standard Oil was worth over $1 trillion. Or Johan van Oldenbarnevelt, the guy who started the Dutch East India company, which adjusted for inflation was worth over $8.2 trillion. Modern companies have nothing on what entrepreneurs did in the past and how much money they made. It doesn't matter how many markets El…

>I'd still say that John Rockefeller is more impressive. Adjusted for inflation John Rockefeller's company Standard Oil was worth over $1 trillion dollars. >Or Johan van Oldenbarnevelt, the guy who started the Dutch East India company

Yeah, it's amazing what those guys could get away with back in the days of slavery and before regulation. /sarcasm

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