Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over • Hacker News Board

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#91

Post by victor9000 » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:31 PM UTC

trimbo wrote: post #88

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

I mean, do you own a nice house or car? If you do, you've already experienced this sizing-up. A contractor comes to the house and sees you can afford 2x what they'd normally charge. A mechanic for your Lexus charges N times as much as the same mechanic would for your Toyota, even though they're the same parts and manufacturer.

Which is why you should get wage quotes over the phone.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#92

Post by gamblor956 » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:32 PM UTC

This policy has actually been pretty great for me. Ubers that once cost $4-5 started costing $10-$15, so I started walking and taking public transportation more.

Actually ended up getting to places faster than taking Uber, since I didn't end up waiting 10-15 minutes for the Uber to work its way through traffic to me, or the extra 10-15 minutes taking an Uber would entail due to drivers missing turns or getting lost (despite having a phone providing directions right in front of their faces...).

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#93

Post by C14L » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:36 PM UTC

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

Then, soon, there will be Uber arbitrage: I only order food from cheep places, so I get great prices for Uber rides. Now, you can pay me to order the Uber ride for you. I get half of what you safed had you ordered the ride yourself. Deal?

(I never used an Uber and have no idea if that would work)

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#94

Post by C14L » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:41 PM UTC

opportune wrote: post #80

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

The worst part about price discrimination is that if there are a limited number of players in the market, it feels like, and maybe effectively is, price fixing. Now, it may not play out as direct collusion, but if only one company engages in it, they won’t be competitive for their wealthier customers, so it doesn’t make much sense. But if both participants in a duopoly do it, you have no options. It wouldn’t be possi…

> they won’t be competitive for their wealthier customers

Sure they will. You don't charge too much so that the customer will start feeling that its worth their time to look for alternative offers. That upper limit it usually higher the wealthier (or "spending happy") the customer is. So it totally makes sense to establish that limit individually per costomer.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#95

Post by buckminster » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:42 PM UTC

trimbo wrote: post #88

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

I mean, do you own a nice house or car? If you do, you've already experienced this sizing-up. A contractor comes to the house and sees you can afford 2x what they'd normally charge. A mechanic for your Lexus charges N times as much as the same mechanic would for your Toyota, even though they're the same parts and manufacturer.

Similarly, the price of a venue or a band or a caterer is at least double if it's for a wedding.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#96

Post by brightball » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:43 PM UTC

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

It would likely lead to people working harder to find better prices.

I moved into a nice house that was about to be foreclosed a couple of years back and after moving in, we had to get some of the same things done that we’d had at our previous home. The quotes were usually 2-3x higher for the exact same job.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#97

Post by alkonaut » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:44 PM UTC

hdlothia wrote: post #58

I'm fine with paying taxi prices with uber and lyft experience. The taxi experience was awful. Spotty acceptance of debit cards, racism, half truths from dispatch. They were insulated from innovation for so long

It's poor competition. In cities where there is a free taxi market Uber is just like every other taxi company (so every taxi company has apps for booking, has nice cars, has pre-payment etc). In cities with medallion systems or other artificial monopolies, you aren't going to get that.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#98

Post by redler » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:45 PM UTC

alecbenzer wrote: post #46

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

I share the intuition that price discrimination feels wrong, but I have trouble really articulating why. Why is "the seller would have given it to me for less" any better than "the buyer would have given me more for it"?

The more targeted the discrimination, the worse it feels. They're targeting your ability to pay, but also your weaknesses. Imagine highly accurate, pervasive, and real-time user profiling (and sharing of information among big companies), and it's not hard to imagine, in the case of Uber, being charged more the day after your paycheck clears, more if they know your specific flight arrived late, more if they know the car rental companies at the airport have low inventory, more if your selected destination is the hotel at which they know you have a reservation, only being presented with "black car" options if they know you have an upcoming business meeting, etc.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#99

Post by wilde » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:45 PM UTC

Barrin92 wrote: post #89

admn2 wrote: post #19

Pretty crazy with Juul, WeWork, DoorDash, and Uber / Lyft all struggling (or showing their true colors) that all the things they sought to kill are coming back. Taxis, cigarettes, picking up your own food! It's amazing to me that people were having food delivered from a half mile away.

>Pretty crazy with Juul, WeWork, DoorDash, and Uber / Lyft all struggling Given that the entire value-added of a company like Uber is getting a taxi to you slightly faster it's not surprising at all. Uber didn't make cars cheaper, drivers faster or added productivity in any other way plus they have a gigantic and expensive tech overhead, so it was never at all clear to me how they're supposed to be both competitive a…

That’s an oversimplification. Uber’s primary innovations were social. They convinced riders that it was safe to jump into a stranger’s car, and drivers that it was safe to run an illegal taxi business. They managed to do both of these things effectively in large enough volumes to change how people think about taxis. Both of these things seem boring and normal now, but they were radical a decade ago.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#100

Post by Enginerrrd » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 7:45 PM UTC

brightball wrote: post #96

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

It would likely lead to people working harder to find better prices. I moved into a nice house that was about to be foreclosed a couple of years back and after moving in, we had to get some of the same things done that we’d had at our previous home. The quotes were usually 2-3x higher for the exact same job.

This isn't all exploitative. I used to work trades and we regularly found the richer clients to be absolute PITA's about super minor details. They were the first ones to threaten not to pay unless we redid a big thing and also wouldn't offer to compensate for any phase of that.