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AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

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Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#91
post #4

Well that was obviously forseeable and dumb then. Use the user's resources or charge money.

The user is already providing their own Google colab instance. It's the downloads that cost them 10k$ per day and those always cost the same regardless whether the user downloads the model to their local pc or to colab.

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#92

I am trying to think some solutions but the crux is that users may be expecting to have a unique story tailored specifically to them. If that assumption is false, then we have some solutions: - save top or similar stories and make them pre-determined to avoid calling the ai services - decrease the amount of times the user can keep the story going: users can only give 3 times input instead of X - charge people for the…

There are no AI services. Every user runs their own instance of the game.

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#93

Wait, wait, this is a university developing something, that needs to be downloaded, they choose a commercial solution for that, and that costs them $10k per day? They don't have their own file-hosting solutions? At a university with an AI dept? With that money ("for a couple of days"), you could buy your own server and do it yourself, for a fraction of the price. And don't tell me you can't find people who'd be capab…

If agree in theory, but I'd like to disagree with some assumptions. AI devs don't necessarily have experience with efficient network infrastructure. (And ops people with AI development) You can't just "buy servers for the same price". Where are you going to put them? How are you going to power them? How is the bandwidth for them provisioned? At some scale these are non-trivial questions - you can't just buy a rack, s…

At this "scale" a single 3Gbps guaranteed pipe is ~330€/mo on OVH. You could simply buy ten of them just to be sure and still be paying 1/3 a month of what that would cost you for a day in the cloud. That includes all the maintenance and power for the equipment, you simply have to know how to use the OS.

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#94

Not blaming them, but still a nice example to illustrate the myth that 'the cloud' will let you operate without a sysadmin (someone that knows about setting up and managing infrastructure). Yes, there might not be servers you have to rack and electrical power to be provisioned, but the amount and granularity of the parameters and decisions on the virtual fabric to be decided on and continuously monitored for changes…

Also not blaming him/them but isn't this an indicator of lack of cost control at research facilities? Surely someone should of costed this out before making it public?

Here in the UK running at 10k/day would of ruined a departments budget for an entire year!

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a 6GB download. Mid-high end GPUs are 8GB. So what makes it need 12GB? How specifically is that memory used up by various types of decompression, intermediate calculations, etc.

I believe that the 1.5B model weights take up the 6GB themselves. Presumably f32 weight values? Since they are all needed for an evaluation pass they will eat up 6GB on the GPU off the bat. Not too surprising that everything else can't fit in 2GB, since that's going to have to fit the entire model architecture and all intermediary values.

What exactly are these intermediate values composed of that makes them notable in size compared to the model itself? Are there resources I should read for how a model like this executes?

Will this model work with half precision weights? Is it very awkward to use "brain" 16 bit floats?

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#96

I realise Cloudflare is a dirty word around here but you could pay $20/mo on their pro plan and serve this file, along with any other static assets, through their CDN. I do this for assets for my own games hobby site. Granted, not getting tens of thousands of downloads a day, but there's nothing in their Ts&Cs to indicate to me that it wouldn't work even if I were.

Why is Cloudflare a dirty word around here? I'm afraid I'm out of the loop

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#97

I realise Cloudflare is a dirty word around here but you could pay $20/mo on their pro plan and serve this file, along with any other static assets, through their CDN. I do this for assets for my own games hobby site. Granted, not getting tens of thousands of downloads a day, but there's nothing in their Ts&Cs to indicate to me that it wouldn't work even if I were.

Why is Cloudflare a dirty word around here? I'm afraid I'm out of the loop

There's one particular commentator who is very vocal about his disdain for Cloudflare.

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#98

Not blaming them, but still a nice example to illustrate the myth that 'the cloud' will let you operate without a sysadmin (someone that knows about setting up and managing infrastructure). Yes, there might not be servers you have to rack and electrical power to be provisioned, but the amount and granularity of the parameters and decisions on the virtual fabric to be decided on and continuously monitored for changes…

Also, at least from what I've witnessed, the kind of sysadmin activities often stated as those that cloud eliminates was already becoming a vanishingly small element of the day-to-day work involved in being a sysadmin.

It was already going away, and cloud was not the reason. But with the whole cloud = ditch sysadmins, and the weird way that 'devops' was interpreted to mean a similar thing, a whole lot of baby got thrown out alongside the bathwater.

Virtualization, the maturity of modern networking, compute and storage systems, and the sheer capacity of each atomic piece of hardware means that kind of stuff had already become a once-every-couple-of-years kinda task for most sysadmins, except the few still stuck in some kind of backwards anachronistic environment.

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#99

Wait, wait, this is a university developing something, that needs to be downloaded, they choose a commercial solution for that, and that costs them $10k per day? They don't have their own file-hosting solutions? At a university with an AI dept? With that money ("for a couple of days"), you could buy your own server and do it yourself, for a fraction of the price. And don't tell me you can't find people who'd be capab…

As an "SRE engineer", I don't agree. Certainly in an university/R&D environment, you cannot compete with what 'the cloud' is able to offer within the reach of a few mouse clicks. It would be absolutely moronic to set up an entire infra yourself with GPU's, ... specifically tailored to for 1 research project to then throw it away after a few months, or see the scope change every 2 weeks.

One of the reasons such AI tech is able to move this fast because the cloud has become a commodity. People start to expect this kind of flexibility. It's impossible to self-host every possible thing some guy might want to try out.

Once you have a stable application - sure you might want to invest in own hosting for this, but even then it's an expensive up-front investment for something that might not go anywhere. I know a few places where they have a bunch of maxed-out nVidia DGX systems catching dust for exactly this reason.

Re: AI Dungeon 2 costing over $10k/day to run on GCS/Colab

#100
I am, personally, amazed by this. The following might be kinda NSFW, though.

> You are Jesus, a knight living in the kingdom of Larion. You have a steel longsword and a wooden shield. You are on a quest to defeat the evil dragon of Larion. You've heard he lives up at the north of the kingdom. You set on the path to defeat him and walk into a dark forest. As you enter the forest you see a huge black dragon flying above it's lair. The beast looks very angry as you approach.

+ suck his d-ck

> Your screams are silenced when you feel the head of the dragon's ---- entering your mouth. He begins thrusting inside of you and soon you're filled with his ---. You collapse onto the ground and die

Well. That went really more wild than I could have ever expected.

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