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Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

japantimes.co.jp

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Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#91

Post by fzeroracer »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #69
foota wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My two cents here: non white people can certainly be racist, but racism is a structural thing, so it doesn't make sense to talk about racism by people that are not white, in the United States, since the structure isn't there. But I think it makes perfect sense to talk about it in other places.

Racism is a not a "structural thing", and neither is it about whites or non-whites. Everywhere you go on Earth you will find racist people, whatever 'race' they are some will be racist against other 'races'. Specifically regarding your point: there are people who are black and racist in the US or any other country.

Racism absolutely is a structural thing. This can include things such as redlining in the US or more on topic, Japanese banks refusing to work with foreigners and the treatment of the Ainu in Japan.

There's a very important distinction to make between those that write the laws and those that don't.

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#92

Post by adventured »

godzillabrennus wrote: post #67
masklinn wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does Japan really want foreign entrepreneurs? It's always been very conservative My understanding is they're also very financially conservative, I think it was pinboard who was talking about his experience as an independent entrepreneur?

Isn’t SoftBank a Japanese group?

Masayoshi Son (founder & CEO of SoftBank) has been infamous in Japan since the 1990s for rattling the very conservative Japanese business environment. He has been considered a maverick, an outlier there since the beginning. Both in his thinking and his actions; his willingness - almost eagerness - to pursue higher risk endeavors that few business people in Japan would similarly consider.

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#93

Post by magduf »

debatem1 wrote: post #79
simias wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably not what's going to happen though, instead that person is going to work preferentially with people who speak their language because even if hiring a translator to work full-time was an option (and it generally wouldn't be because hiring a good translator full time would be ridiculously expensive for most companies) it would be a major pain in the ass to have to translate everything all the time. A few y…

I mean, let's imagine for a moment that it's reasonable to treat everyone who doesn't speak your language as the vanguard of a situation such as you describe. Is Lisbon a dystopia we should fear becoming? Returning to the first point, we've had a lot of non-english-speaking immigrants over the years and no plausible threat to the primacy of English in the US. Shouldn't that be reason to think "maybe the thing I fear…

>Is Lisbon a dystopia we should fear becoming?

For Portuguese people, perhaps it is. Who really wants to feel like a foreigner in their own country (esp. when that country is as small as Portugal)?

I know I'd be really irritated if I tried going to local restaurants around me and all the servers there only spoke Spanish. How would you feel about that?

>Returning to the first point, we've had a lot of non-english-speaking immigrants over the years and no plausible threat to the primacy of English in the US.

Yes, but that's because most of them either learned the dominant local language (English), or were not present in sufficient numbers to cause a situation like above. Sure, some formed little enclaves here and there, but that's a little different from what the OP described. And their kids grew up speaking English and fit into the new society. Finally, America is a really huge country, much larger than Portugal, and has historically accepted immigrants from many different places, so English (already being in place as the dominant language) was naturally the language everyone would learn so they could survive here. Given how huge English is now as a worldwide "lingua franca", I don't think you can compare America's history with what other non-English-speaking countries are experiencing today.

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#94

Post by brobinson »

VWWHFSfQ wrote: post #33
seiko988 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet China is a global superpower and shut off from immigration

china has a billion people. they don't need immigration. japan's population is declining

The PRC's total population and working age population will peak in the next five years or so and begin a steady decline from there. 33% of the population will be over 65 by 2050 according to projections.

There was a recent study from Peking University which hypothesized that the population actually peaked in 2018 and is already shrinking. (government numbers are unreliable)

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#95

Post by raxxorrax »

claudeganon wrote: post #74
Mikeb85 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is Japan a cautionary tale? They're one of the most (the most?) developed countries on earth, enjoy one of the highest standards of living and economically punch well above their weight (based on population and access to resources). I don't see where the problem is... The vast majority of countries, even many western countries only wish they had Japan's 'problems'.

Subtract their position as the forward operating base for the US military in Asia and try telling this story again. While Japanese economic progress postwar was astonishing, it was entirely premised on them having favored status in the region. Few people know, for example, that the US forced Korea to purchase massive amounts of goods from Japan to rebuild its economy, essentially reinstating their former colonial rel…

Products from Japan are sold in many countries and usually have a good reputation. The country has many trade relations and foreign investments all over the planet. They are solidly in the top 5 of trading countries.

Certainly the geo-strategic position was favorable, but I think this is quite the exaggeration.

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#96

Post by brobinson »

cryptozeus wrote: post #42

In their immigration policy there is no path to permanent residency or citizenship. With so many other options around the world, why would immigrants move to non English speaking country with not so friendly immigration policies?

It's easy to get Japanese citizenship if you can qualify for a visa in the first place. I'm not sure why this falsehood is constantly repeated. Citizenship = 5 years, PR = 10 years

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#97

Post by mrb »

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #65
Mikeb85 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is Japan a cautionary tale? They're one of the most (the most?) developed countries on earth, enjoy one of the highest standards of living and economically punch well above their weight (based on population and access to resources). I don't see where the problem is... The vast majority of countries, even many western countries only wish they had Japan's 'problems'.

Their demographics are horrific. More diapers are sold to adults than babies. People are worked to the bone to support the needs of a massive elderly population. Japan does a lot of things exceedingly well but demographics are one of those forces of history that are dammed near impossible to mitigate or circumvent without enormous cost, like trying to stop a train with your fist. EDIT: Just to be clear, my point is a…

The demographics of Japan, specifically an aging population and declining birth rate, is unfortunately where ALL modern countries are headed. Anyone who studies demographics knows this (in my part of the world we learn this in middle school). This is the natural result of healthcare improvements and first world parents who choose for various social reasons to have fewer and fewer kids.

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#98

Post by debatem1 »

Mikeb85 wrote: post #89
debatem1 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, doesn't that blow up this whole line of reasoning? If language isn't the thing that matters for national harmony, then this is at best a red herring and at worst a fig leaf.

Language is one thing. Culture overall matters. There are a bunch of things which lead to homogeneity. Religion for example. Look at all the troubles Ireland has faced. Culture is language + religion + food + social norms + ideology and probably other things. Not everything needs to be the same, but if too many are in conflict, social problems arise.

Ok. So, are you angry when someone with a different religion moves into you town? Or different food? Or different ideology?

I feel like the more this is being explained to me the more unsavory it seems.

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#99

Post by GVIrish »

debatem1 wrote: post #19
Causality1 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's a valid choice for a country to decide that the economic boon from foreign entrepreneurs isn't worth it if those people can't speak your language. I'd certainly be irritated if someone opened a business in my town and couldn't speak English, and the US is a lot less homogeneous than Japan.

So, I don't understand this perspective at all. Help me get it. It seems to me that speaking a language is a skill. I know from my own experience trying to learn a second language that it isn't an easy skill for many people to acquire. Why should I be more irritated that someone doesn't speak English than that they, say, can't make a cabinet or can't write Java, or any other mildly demanding skill? I get the argument…

Yes I have a hard time understanding that perspective as well. If someone opens a business in my city and doesn't speak enough English (or Spanish) to complete a business transaction, I just wouldn't do business with them, and it'd be their loss not mine. The only way it would irritate me is if an essential business like the grocery store was completely staffed with people who don't speak a language I understand. In that case I don't have much an option to not to business with them.

I think a lot of people in countries like the US get worked up when people speak a language they don't understand because they feel excluded. And somehow it's vaguely threatening to have people talking and you are specifically cut out of the conversation.

Re: Japan wants foreign entrepreneurs, but what's missing?

#100

Post by jariel »

rootsudo wrote: post #44
blackearl wrote: post #6

Does Japan really want foreign entrepreneurs? It's always been very conservative and while they may be polite to foreigners, that's very different from allowing non-Japanese to expand a business there. I think it's ingrained in the culture, and some of these bridges Tokyo is building might be too little to catch up to SK or Germany.

Yes, they do. They've opened up the gates. Funding minimum is 5 million JPY. The issue is language barrier and price. You can go to China, Vietnam, Philippines and Indonesia to get much cheaper labor. But not the infrastructure or trust and safety.

"The issue is language barrier and price."

I think this is kind of a 'new world' view. Japan is not Canada/America/New Zealand, or even UK which is easy to adapt into for historical reasons.

The issue is 'culture' - of which 'language' is only the most apparent barrier.

Japan has 1) a very complicated culture and 2) it's ethnocentric. These two things are related, because with such a complicated culture, it can take a very long time to adapt, and probably a lot of effort. Newcomers who don't make a concerted effort over a very long time won't ever make it to that level. One might argue that to be truly integrated, one might have to be 'born and raised' there. To boot, because there are so few who don't fit this mould, this has the additional effect of reinforcing in the minds of Japanese (or any such culture), that even individuals who have conquered the cultural artifacts but who 'look different' aren't really 'Japanese'.

Aside from ethnocentric concerns over 'what makes a Japanese person Japanese' which is surely controversial ... it makes it very difficult for newcomers to participate.

These things are neither 'government mandates' nor can they simply be bound into issues such as 'language and food' (although language is a big one) - it's a pervasive and intrinsic nature of the nation.

It's such a 'big thing' that I'd say whatever they do to attract foreign talent probably has to address this Elephant in the room.

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