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Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

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Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#91

Post by zepearl »

k__ wrote: post #57

Could build it on the old airport.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin_Brandenburg_Airport#Pro...

It was originally intended to replace both Schönefeld and Berlin Tegel Airport and become the single commercial airport serving Berlin and the surrounding State of Brandenburg, an area with a combined 6 million inhabitants. However, it is now planned that it will not replace any, with Schönefeld Airport currently being expanded due to rising passenger numbers, and Tegel which will remain open after a referendum.

After almost 15 years of planning, construction began in 2006. Originally planned to open in October 2011, the airport has encountered a series of delays and cost overruns.

Since German reunification, air traffic in Berlin has grown greatly. In 1991, the combined passenger volume of the city's airports was at 7.9 million per year. By 2014, this number had risen to 28 million. When Berlin Brandenburg opens, it will have a capacity of 27 million passengers per year.

Summarized: when/if BER will open, if it will manage to handle immediately its max capacity (best-case scenario), it won't have enough capacity => the other airports will still be needed (until BER is expanded) :|

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#92

Post by mqus »

tnolet wrote: post #52

I'm curious about how the massive left/anti-fa movement in Berlin will react to this one. They kept out Google after massive protests. Not sure this is the same thing though. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/oct/24/google-ab... p.s. I'm based in Berlin. Have no horse in the race except that the Google office would have been right down the street of where I work.

As they want to open their factory next to the new Airport, it will basically be in Brandenburg and not in the center of Berlin (not that it would fit there). They probably will change the neighbourhood there, but automobile engineers are perceived as worker class while google techies generally are not. I also think that Google would have had no problems If they would have opened their office in Adlershof.

So to summarize:

Tesla:

- builds factory in a practically greenfield area

- employs middle-class workers

Google:

- buys old building in the middle of the "hip" leftist city district

- employs high-wage workers which will drive gentrification

So I think this will be received at least with mixed voices, but mostly positively.

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#93

Post by detaro »

mqus wrote: post #92
tnolet wrote: post #52

I'm curious about how the massive left/anti-fa movement in Berlin will react to this one. They kept out Google after massive protests. Not sure this is the same thing though. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/oct/24/google-ab... p.s. I'm based in Berlin. Have no horse in the race except that the Google office would have been right down the street of where I work.

As they want to open their factory next to the new Airport, it will basically be in Brandenburg and not in the center of Berlin (not that it would fit there). They probably will change the neighbourhood there, but automobile engineers are perceived as worker class while google techies generally are not. I also think that Google would have had no problems If they would have opened their office in Adlershof. So to summ…

> I also think that Google would have had no problems If they would have opened their office in Adlershof.

Google probably could have moved their office location ~2 km and have been fine. But they really wanted to sit right in the hornet nest.

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#94

Post by propercoil »

zamfi wrote: post #81
jayalpha wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand your post at all. "so that no one would stifle the company's path towards autonomous EV's." Who is "stifling"? And many companies work on autonomous cars. "This will produce pressure on Europe to ease for instance the AI regulations" What AI regulations in Europe? And what is Europe? The EU? "and basically removed Customs tax" This is not how custom taxes work. The EU is one of the biggest free tra…

> "and basically removed Customs tax" > This is not how custom taxes work. The EU is one of the biggest free trade zone in the world. If Mercosul joins, it is the biggest. Wait, isn't this is exactly how custom taxes work? Say the EU charges a 10% tax on all imported passenger cars (it does, and 25% on pickups and other trucks). Now, if Tesla sells cars to the EU that were made in the USA, wouldn't it trigger that im…

You’re right on both. Just as an added plus Tesla will have better tariffs to other countries while taking advantage of each of its hosting jurisdiction’s bilateral deals, so the impact is larger.

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#95

Post by k__ »

sneak wrote: post #65
k__ wrote: post #57

Could build it on the old airport.

https://brandenburg-braucht-tegel.de/ There are a lot of Berliners who love Tegel and don't want it to close even when BBI is eventually open (whenever that may be). TXL is truly a fantastic airport, and would become even better when not overcrowded.

I meant Tempelhof :D

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#96

Post by propercoil »

SEJeff wrote: post #83
propercoil wrote: post #24

Good strategy from Treelon overall. You'll have Tesla producing cars and employing thousands of workers in the U.S, China & Germany so that no one would stifle the company's path towards autonomous EV's. This will produce pressure on Europe to ease for instance the AI regulations and basically removed Customs tax from many other countries because Tesla can send the cars from three different locations. I just don't un…

I will say that Tel Aviv and Haifa both have excellent engineers. As Tesla grows I'd be a bit surprised if they didn't have engineers in Israel. That said, most of the engineering is still based out of Silicon Valley, so that might be why? As a tesla fan and owner, I hope you get your superchargers. I've heard rumors that they've just started seriously producing the supercharger v3 hardware at the Buffalo, NY factory…

He got hammered by us but unfortunately nothing from him referencing Israel. I don’t blame him, no one can filter all these tweets.

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#97

Post by detaro »

k__ wrote: post #95
sneak wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://brandenburg-braucht-tegel.de/ There are a lot of Berliners who love Tegel and don't want it to close even when BBI is eventually open (whenever that may be). TXL is truly a fantastic airport, and would become even better when not overcrowded.

I meant Tempelhof :D

You really think turning a popular public park (or if you mean the buildings, a publicly owned/used building with preservation status) in a central-ish location in the city, with worse freight transport connections than the airport, into a factory is a sensible or politically viable solution?

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#98

Post by cyberpunk »

DanielleMolloy wrote: post #84
tnolet wrote: post #52

I'm curious about how the massive left/anti-fa movement in Berlin will react to this one. They kept out Google after massive protests. Not sure this is the same thing though. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/oct/24/google-ab... p.s. I'm based in Berlin. Have no horse in the race except that the Google office would have been right down the street of where I work.

This was a pure territorial war. I’ve seen the German campaign material, there was no sign of good reasons, at most a lot of misunderstanding of the idea of a startup incubator. I remember how I had to explain the idea to a very vocal campaigner who clearly did not get that Google was not planning to open a big dev center in their kiez after Google gave up. The underlying reason was the fear of rents rising in Kreuzb…

Oi, I live in spandau. It's very green...

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#99

Post by jcranmer »

choeger wrote: post #2

Please drop your inevitable BER jokes below so we can recylce them properly later.

Wait, so if I have this correct, the airport took ~6 years to construct and 9 years and counting to correct problems with its construction? Meaning that it would have been faster to tear the entire building down and rebuild it from scratch than it is taking to remedy the issues?

How does that happen‽

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#100

Post by sneak »

detaro wrote: post #97
k__ wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I meant Tempelhof :D

You really think turning a popular public park (or if you mean the buildings, a publicly owned/used building with preservation status) in a central-ish location in the city, with worse freight transport connections than the airport, into a factory is a sensible or politically viable solution?

I would have gone with “It’s already in use.”
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