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The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

thehftguy.com

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Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#91

Post by user5994461 »

psv1 wrote: post #9

> If you’re (only) a docker expert, you’re in troubles right now. There are no more jobs looking for docker expertise and you’re dangerously close to unemployable. This is such a silly and unrealistic argument - no one is a docker-only expert. And docker is a desirable skill, just not on its own. It's like saying that git-only experts are unemployable.

Author here. I appreciate that it can seem silly but it is a very real thing I see happening.

I tried to illustrate with some concrete examples. Like being asked about pods and ingress in interviews, which are kubernetes specific. Experience with docker doesn't help much here, gotta keep up with Kubernetes. You could de-facto fail the interview if the interviewer realizes you didn't work with kubernetes but docker alone.

Companies are super biased toward kubernetes. They're really looking for the unicorn with years of kubernetes experience in production.

Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#92

Post by williamallthing »

wyaeld wrote: post #10
protomikron wrote: post #2

And yet I still have to deploy my first Kubernetes setup and have used Docker multiple times ... Is there some kind of "Kubernetes-light" out there? So something like in-between running services like NGinx and Postgres on bare Linux machines and having this (I think complex) Kubernetes setup? It's important to say that I don't need any scaling capabilities (apart from maybe some load-balancing in case of a machine er…

easiest way is just start experimenting with GKE on google cloud, and see if it has value to you. Don't bother trying to deploy and manage it before you've kicked the tires. Out of the box its quite good, depending on what you are doing, once you have cert-manager issuing you free certs, linkerd managing a service mesh, and stackdriver giving you an entire ops stack, its a bit hard to go back

Thanks for the Linkerd shoutout! For those who aren't familiar with the project, Linkerd will give you per-service metrics (success rates, RPS, latency distributions), mutual TLS, load balancing, and a bunch of other cool stuff, on almost any Kubernetes app, right out of the box. No config necessary.

Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#93

Post by user5994461 »

tilolebo wrote: post #80

The best reason to use Kubernetes (and in many cases the only reason) is to boost your employability. It gets harder and harder to find a stack that doesn't rely on it. At my company, we chose to use ECS/Fargate when possible. It integrates nicely with SSM Parameter Store for config and secrets, and has a simple service discovery feature based on DNS. A few services run on EC2 + ASG, using AMIs build with Ansible and…

Author here. It's all about employability indeed and it's sad many other commenters don't seem to grasp that.

DevOps/SRE jobs are full on discriminating for kubernetes experience, not docker, and preferably on their exact stack AWS ECS, EKS, GKE, etc... it can get real tough as a job seeker if you're not on it.

Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#94

Post by user5994461 »

skywhopper wrote: post #37

This article just sort of meanders without going anywhere or providing any insight. Certainly no new insight. Docker the company didn’t manage to solve the right problems in time. K8s hype is through the roof. But the irony is that the Docker infrastructure is a critical dependency for the vast majority of K8s users. And if it falls apart, a lot of stuff is going to break. I hope someone has some contingency plans fo…

I tried to cover that near the conclusion. It's likely that someone would offer docker a reasonable amount because of the docker hub and the registered users. Don't think they would sell though.

AWS, Google, Azure should already have mirrors in place for their own offerings, should be ready to substitute to docker hub.

Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#95

Post by infogulch »

prima-facie wrote: post #17

> If you’re (only) a docker expert, you’re in troubles right now. There are no more jobs looking for docker expertise and you’re dangerously close to unemployable. > Kubernetes has succeeded where docker failed. Management buy-in. This must be one of the silliest articles I've read in a long time. Computer science and engineering does not revolve around the latest devops flavour du-jour. It will be something else in…

I would say docker's real innovation was the introduction of reproducibility to system software at the OS-level. Or, it was a vote of no-confidence in the old way of patching/upgrading/deploying/building software. Or, static linking won.

The Linux features like cgroups/overlayfs etc that were used to deliver reproducibility at an acceptable performance cost are more of an implementation detail than the actual innovation, imo. I think one of the co-founders of docker might agree [1].

[1]: https://twitter.com/solomonstre/status/1111004913222324225

Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#96

Post by user5994461 »

segmondy wrote: post #83

thehftguy sometimes has very good articles, but it's obvious he doesn't know/understand much about the container landscape. He would be correct if he said, "The demise of Docker swarm and rise of Kubernetes" For those that don't know, Kubernetes is a container orchestrator. That means when you have lots of containers, hundreds or thousands and lots of servers to run them on. Instead of wiring them manually and deploy…

Author here. Thank you.

The point is really about docker, not docker swarm. Kubernetes is integrating the whole ecosystem vertically and it's being leveraged to push out docker. There are lots of actors at play incentivized and actively working against docker (not just docker swarm).

I guess it's more of a business and marketing lesson if anything.

Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#98

Post by user5994461 »

jannes wrote: post #57

> If you’ve run a “apt-get install mysql” in the past decade, high chances it setup MariaDB instead, getting aliased and substituted transparently. Is that true on Ubuntu/Debian? I couldn't find a source for this.

True on Debian. I don't remember much articles or noise about it, it sort of just happened.

One article here, debian jessie 8 is from 2015. https://mariadb.com/kb/en/library/moving-from-mysql-to-maria...

Re: The demise of Docker and the rise of Kubernetes

#100

Post by sandGorgon »

raesene9 wrote: post #65
sandGorgon wrote: post #24

Docker has not built support for cgroups v2 - which has been available in linux for 3 years. https://github.com/opencontainers/runc/issues/654 in order to force this issue, Fedora has made cgroups v2 as default and mandatory in the new upcoming Fedora 31 causing docker to fail to run. https://github.com/docker/for-linux/issues/665 Podman (and other docker equivalents) have supported cgroups v2 for years. I suspect th…

Out of curiousity, have you seen anywhere using CRI-O/podman in production in place of Docker anywhere?

https://github.com/cri-o/cri-o/blob/master/awesome.md

there are sections on using cri-o on EKS AWS

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