The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace • Hacker News Board

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#91

Post by chrisweekly » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 1:43 PM UTC

greggman2 wrote: post #68

Since remote work seems to be the topic this article on async communication spawned I wanted to throw this out there for reactions. First off let me acknowledge that some people prefer remote work and also say up front I do not. I recent YouAreNotSoSmart podcast interviewed Laurie Santos from Yale and if I understood her research basically claims we often both individually and as a society choose things we think will…

Good points. As someone who's had the option to work remotely for most of my ~21 year career, I find the sweet spot is a mix. For writing code / solving hard problems / doing "Deep Work", I am much more effective when I can control my environment and eliminate not just time and stress of commute but rule out whole categories of distraction and interruption. OTOH, there is no substitute for human connection; in terms of team dynamics, personal energy / motivation, and effectiveness in driving change, my most impactful moments and projects have all benefited hugely (if not outright depended on) my physical presence. Of course YMMV. So much depends on your personality, your role, your team and manager and company... but IMHO / IME, a mix of remote and onsite is ideal.

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#92

Post by gm » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 1:44 PM UTC

"No expectation of immediate reply"? HA! I SO wish. Slack kills any async expectation. Specially if you install it on your cellphone. Then you're on the clock 24/7.

I guess the article also assumes different time zones when working remotely?

I filed the article under the "rubbish bin". I've worked remotely for several years, and maybe I live in a different planet, because "async" and remote work do NOT go hand in hand for me. If anything, Slack means people can reach me even when I'm taking a dump, and I'm expected to reply at that moment.

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#93

Post by MarkMc » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 1:46 PM UTC

If remote workers are more productive, why aren't most office jobs remote?

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#94

Post by xfitm3 » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 1:57 PM UTC

monkeydust wrote: post #90

Personally I think flexibility is the future. Allow employees to decide or work inhouse or remotely. I work in a very large financial services technology company. I value to closeness to colleges and the quick, sharp interactions that can happen with that - but - there are times when I am wokring on something larger I would be more effective at home or a remote location where sales etc can physically come to my desk…

I hope flexibility is the future. I take advantage of this a lot, but unfortunately, my company has a lot of new managers. They LOVE meetings. I really cant stand it.

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#95

Post by mewpmewp » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 1:57 PM UTC

gm wrote: post #92

"No expectation of immediate reply"? HA! I SO wish. Slack kills any async expectation. Specially if you install it on your cellphone. Then you're on the clock 24/7. I guess the article also assumes different time zones when working remotely? I filed the article under the "rubbish bin". I've worked remotely for several years, and maybe I live in a different planet, because "async" and remote work do NOT go hand in han…

How do you know people expect you to answer immediately? I haven't noticed that expectation.

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#96

Post by 0xcde4c3db » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 1:58 PM UTC

greggman2 wrote: post #68

Since remote work seems to be the topic this article on async communication spawned I wanted to throw this out there for reactions. First off let me acknowledge that some people prefer remote work and also say up front I do not. I recent YouAreNotSoSmart podcast interviewed Laurie Santos from Yale and if I understood her research basically claims we often both individually and as a society choose things we think will…

A problem with most theories like this is that they treat interaction as though it can only ever add up to a positive impact. Too much unwanted interaction can burn somebody out just as much as not enough wanted interaction. That's one of the reasons that we talk about "emotional labor".

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#97

Post by gm » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 2:04 PM UTC

mewpmewp wrote: post #95

gm wrote: post #92

"No expectation of immediate reply"? HA! I SO wish. Slack kills any async expectation. Specially if you install it on your cellphone. Then you're on the clock 24/7. I guess the article also assumes different time zones when working remotely? I filed the article under the "rubbish bin". I've worked remotely for several years, and maybe I live in a different planet, because "async" and remote work do NOT go hand in han…

How do you know people expect you to answer immediately? I haven't noticed that expectation.

They ask questions which imply "I'm sitting on my hands until you answer me".

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#98

Post by dunkelheit » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 2:08 PM UTC

I think I am not really well-adapted for async communication.

I can't really do "fire and forget" messaging. When I ask something I want the reply to arrive as quickly as possible because I don't want to lose the context that I have in my mind right now and load it again later when I receive a reply. On an async channel this results in compulsive checking for replies which of course kills productivity. Almost-sync channels like Slack are the worst - who didn't experience the frustration of their chat partner suddenly disappearing without a word in the middle of a discussion?

On a related note I very much prefer a focused half-hour meeting to a whole day of async back-and-forths.

Inbound messages are problematic too because they provide the same kind of addictive random gratification that social media is infamous for.

Any tips for dealing with these problems?

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#99

Post by WarDores » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 2:10 PM UTC

jschwartzi wrote: post #85

greggman2 wrote: post #68

Since remote work seems to be the topic this article on async communication spawned I wanted to throw this out there for reactions. First off let me acknowledge that some people prefer remote work and also say up front I do not. I recent YouAreNotSoSmart podcast interviewed Laurie Santos from Yale and if I understood her research basically claims we often both individually and as a society choose things we think will…

Here's an anecdote for you. I work remote and normally make time for activities or groups at least a few times a week. Once, after something upset me I decided to spend a couple weeks not going out. I rapidly went toasty. By the end of the first week I couldn't concentrate on anything. I was restless, anxious, and desperately unhappy. So yes, I need some social interaction to feel normal. But it doesn't come from my…

I think this is the key. I'm not sure "forced interaction" is the answer for everyone. I work remotely and spent yesterday morning for 2 hours just chatting with some folks at a coffee shop I regularly work out of over some common interests. That filled my "meaningful interaction" bucket more than 2 or 3 days of office work in my previous office'd life. My 2 cents as well.

Re: The benefits of a more asynchronous workplace

#100

Post by BurningFrog » Wed, Oct 16, 2019, 2:10 PM UTC

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #2

I tried sharing these studies at my ex employers in Europe hoping they'd spare me the hellish 40 minute commute in stop/start traffic and they weren't interested at all. Management there only values "butt time in seats" and the ability to come over and interrupt you by tapping you on the shoulder whenever they need something. As one of my ex CEOs put it: "If I don't see my employees stressing out at thier desks I get…

Unless your work output is very easy to measure, demanding you show up to work in one of the only ways to ensure you're at least putting in an effort for your employer.

Of course, one of the hardest professions to measure output for is software engineers.

I once worked with a guy who, it was discovered after a long time, actually had two Silicon Valley jobs. That he actually showed up at! He walked/drove between them a few times a day, and managed to keep the illusion up for quite a while.

I'm guessing he has 4 "remote" jobs now :)