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Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

nature.com

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Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#91

Post by zosterops »

flmontpetit wrote: post #11
prongletown wrote: post #7

I've been a vegetarian for a few years. Part of the impetus for my choice was the lack of regulation and health code standards in this country. Recent news that the federal government is reducing inspection of meat really does scare me. How many people need to die (like in the early 1900s) before we re-realize the importance of these regulations on public life? When will the next Upton Sinclair come along?

Upton Sinclair lamented the fact that nobody really got the point of The Jungle. I think after all this time he is about to be proven right.

That point being, to promote socialism.

Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#92

Post by X6S1x6Okd1st »

petre wrote: post #89
prongletown wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>eat well raised cow meat It takes significantly more feed to raise a cow. The calories extracted from cow meat is extremely inefficient considering the high number of calories in (feed) and water. So, you could not use feed (vegetable death-per-calorie!) because it's something like a 8:1 calorie ratio for feed to a pound of beef. You'd have to pasture raise the cows. There is no feasible way to ensure that all food…

What do you propose? That we start eating crickets? Actually I would try some, maybe they taste like shrimp. Shrimp are another quickly reproducing species, but they're also sensitive to pollution.

I've had a dish of lemon grass stir-fried cricket. It was at a restaurant that served lots of bug based dishes. It was one of the few that we had that I'd regularly order.

They didn't taste like shrimp though. They also have a lot of chitin.

Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#94

Post by hombre_fatal »

drak0n1c wrote: post #56

If you're curious why antibiotics are seen as necessary by farmers - I found an insightful Quora answer about US practices: "The antibiotic, not antibiotics, in question is monesin sodium, also known originally by the trade-name Rumensin. It is an anti-biotic in the truest sense- it changes the living conditions for gut flora of a ruminant animal in such a way as to promote the growth of bacteria that produce proprio…

How happy are these animals in the documentary, Dominion?

https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko?t=984

Your post presents a nice rainbows and sunshine guess at how the animal ag industry works, and I really wish it worked like that, too.

Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#95

Post by drak0n1c »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #94
drak0n1c wrote: post #56

If you're curious why antibiotics are seen as necessary by farmers - I found an insightful Quora answer about US practices: "The antibiotic, not antibiotics, in question is monesin sodium, also known originally by the trade-name Rumensin. It is an anti-biotic in the truest sense- it changes the living conditions for gut flora of a ruminant animal in such a way as to promote the growth of bacteria that produce proprio…

How happy are these animals in the documentary, Dominion? https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko?t=984 Your post presents a nice rainbows and sunshine guess at how the animal ag industry works, and I really wish it worked like that, too.

Dominion... of Australia? I quoted Harman Meyerhoff, an independent American dairy farmer.

If the goal is to solve a problem, when hearing different opinions and life experiences a better instinct to have is empathy -- calling people shills won't get you anywhere.

Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#97

Post by cwkoss »

ddeck wrote: post #20
prongletown wrote: post #7

I've been a vegetarian for a few years. Part of the impetus for my choice was the lack of regulation and health code standards in this country. Recent news that the federal government is reducing inspection of meat really does scare me. How many people need to die (like in the early 1900s) before we re-realize the importance of these regulations on public life? When will the next Upton Sinclair come along?

Unfortunately even fruit and vegetables aren't safe. Syphilis and TB antibiotics are being used to combat disease on orange trees in Florida: The E.P.A. has proposed allowing as much as 650,000 pounds of streptomycin to be sprayed on citrus crops each year. By comparison, Americans annually use 14,000 pounds of aminoglycosides, the class of antibiotics that includes streptomycin In its decision to approve two drugs f…

The most terrifying thing about antibiotic resistance is that bacterial will readily take up DNA fragments from dead neighbors (or via sex pillus).

This means that if a benign bacteria develops resistance, that gene can easily find its way into a pathogenic one if they are both in the same environment.

Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#98

Post by spraak »

seanwilson wrote: post #78
warent wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can you explain why producing eggs and cow milk is any less cruel than producing animals only for meat? You're running wild with an assumption that isn't true. Of course it's just as cruel. I don't purchase dairy or eggs, and only consume eggs in restaurants on rare occasions. Really you're preaching to the choir here.

Why do you mention vegetarianism and not e.g. plant-based or vegan then when referring to people being blind to animal cruelty? I genuinely find vegetarianism confusing and want to understand the rationale behind it, especially when someone knows the dairy and egg industry is similarly cruel.

Thanks for calling this out. It's baffling to come across vegetarians at all (I'm vegan btw) talking about ethics. To me it's worse than an omni who thinks they care about animals, because a vegetarian has taken some steps to look into the details, but then decides to stop short.

Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#99

Post by spraak »

warent wrote: post #79
seanwilson wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you mention vegetarianism and not e.g. plant-based or vegan then when referring to people being blind to animal cruelty? I genuinely find vegetarianism confusing and want to understand the rationale behind it, especially when someone knows the dairy and egg industry is similarly cruel.

I can't speak for vegetarianism as a whole. The word is ambiguous at best and only useful as a pointer to the layperson. Most people don't even understand the differences between vegan and vegetarian. Ultimately I find veganism is a form of extremism that isn't right for everyone. Any level of mindful eating is admirable, even if someone changes their constant diet of meat to one of having 1 day a week meat-free for…

> Any level of mindful eating is admirable, even if someone changes their constant diet of meat to one of having 1 day a week meat-free for the sake of animals and the environment is worth applauding.

These kind of baby steps never lead anywhere fruitful. The end goal must be worked towards. Applauding any and every tiny effort just makes people complacent and we never make any real progress. E.g. most vegetarians have no plans to transition to veganism, despite knowing about the cruelties of the egg and dairy industries (which are the same as the poultry and beef industries, just a different point in the pipeline).

Re: Farm animals in India and China are becoming more resistant to antibiotics

#100

Post by spraak »

warent wrote: post #84
seanwilson wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I wish people in general were more educated about the cruelty behind milk, eggs and cheese, so they would seek alternatives. Vegetarians appear to suffer from cognitive dissonance as well.

We're talking about two different things for two different purposes. It is possible for people to eat meat and not experience any cognitive dissonance because they're mindfully aware of what they're consuming, what has gone into it, and the reason behind it. See Native Americans as an example. Yes, even the Dalai Lama consumes meat. I don't judge people for their dietary choices. I'm specifically talking about people…

> because you seem to be using this thread as a soapbox to push an agenda unrelated to the discussion.

It reads more like you continuing to find excuses to not be accountable. Is the Dalia Lama some ethical authority to hold up as a standard for others? He's just a religious figure important to a specific group of Buddhists.

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