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Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

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Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#91
post #4

Absurdity of this video aside, but I just wish there was room in today's political environment to discuss pros and cons to unions and non-unions. There are some pretty good examples of unions being corrupt, there are examples where unions work. There are examples where like Amazon says, having a direct relationship with your employer is the best. Nuance is gone which is the biggest loss.

[deleted]

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#92

If Amazon's work force unionizes, Amazon will cease to be a dynamic company that sees rapid foreign expansion and growth in export revenue it earns for the US. The US will see yet another major driver of innovation and production growth, this time the tech industry, succumb to social activists and their rent-seeking-motivated ideological narratives. A century of pro-union-monopoly advocacy will not change the fact th…

Reminder to everyone that a downvote is not an "I disagree" button. This is a perfectly legitimate opinion to have; stop mobbing people for having a controversial opinion (or at least, mob them with replies and arguments)

On HK the downvote button is in fact an "I disagree" button (or more specifically that is one valid use of it). See:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16131314

Now if it is reasonable that a designed in "disagree" button is also used for automatic moderation (greying/hiding/easier flagging/etc) I'll leave up to the opinions of the reader.

Multiple sites have implemented some form of upvote/downvote. That within itself is a great proxy for agree/disagree. The problem sites have is when they take a downvote to mean both disagree and low quality/bad/de-modded. HK technically has flag to solve this, but that isn't how the site is implemented.

PS - I didn't vote on the post above at all.

PPS - You should downvote this very post per (last line): https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The corporations produce useful stuff, though.

Workers produce useful stuff

Correct, workers do. Unions don't. They are fundamentally parasitic, which isn't necessarily a value judgement.

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#94
post #84
post #4

Absurdity of this video aside, but I just wish there was room in today's political environment to discuss pros and cons to unions and non-unions. There are some pretty good examples of unions being corrupt, there are examples where unions work. There are examples where like Amazon says, having a direct relationship with your employer is the best. Nuance is gone which is the biggest loss.

So little is said about unions today. There was a time when newspapers had a "union beat", and you'd read about who was elected head of the UAW local and how the Steelworkers negotiations were going. It's been a long time since WCFL radio, "The Voice of Labor in Chicago". Few people know how unions work any more. They vary as much as companies do. Some are top down, some are bottom up. Some run their own insurance an…

What's a good way to learn more about the history and function and current status of unions? Are there any good books/resources that aren't particularly biased toward one side or the other?

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#95
post #4

Absurdity of this video aside, but I just wish there was room in today's political environment to discuss pros and cons to unions and non-unions. There are some pretty good examples of unions being corrupt, there are examples where unions work. There are examples where like Amazon says, having a direct relationship with your employer is the best. Nuance is gone which is the biggest loss.

Likewise. Nuance is gone on almost all topics. It's very frustrating.

I honestly believe the Internet, specifically places like Twitter have destroyed civil discussion and consideration of alternate viewpoints.

Also, I don't think the video is absurd at all. What advantage would Amazon have by being pro-union or pretending to be pro-union? And what advantage would they have by not addressing it at all?

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Workers produce useful stuff

Correct, workers do. Unions don't. They are fundamentally parasitic, which isn't necessarily a value judgement.

Unions strengthen workers. A company that negotiated 1000 small contracts has the upper hand in each of them, if it is forced to negotiate 1 big contract, then they are on equal footing.

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#98
post #37

Why is anti-union a bad thing? Couldn't resonate with the idea that union is saving workers. They are not.

Don't you find it at least a little bit suspicious that the big companies are putting so much money and effort into preventing unions "for the benefit of the workers"? Since when has Amazon done anything for the benefit of the workers?

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#99
post #54
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely. Unions brought progress in terms of worker rights, up to a point. They helped transform the landscape for all workers. But, like all big and complex organizations they become corrupted and rather than having the interest of workers and society as foremost goals, self perpetuation and preservation become the goals. Except for Bernie no other candidate explicitly and implicitly supports unions. All the othe…

> Unions brought progress in terms of worker rights, up to a point. What does "up to a point" mean? Like these videos, this makes it sound as if the progress of workers' rights is over, and we've got all we'll ever need. What about, say, "a living wage", which the government's minimum wage law is unable to provide? This isn't done. It will probably never be done.

The thing is not all jobs need pay a living wage. Not everyone works to live. Some people work for extra income and their spouse works for a living. Others work to save for splurge purposes while being supported by parents. Others work for socialization after retirement. Forcing companies to pay living wages for every job means they are more reticent to create jobs which could help take families out of poverty or keep seniors from falling into hard times, etc.

Governments need to pursue policies to ensure there are a surplus of jobs paying living wages for the number of workers that need to live off work. This is not the same as pursuing policies to ensure every job pays a minimum wage.

Re: Amazon's Anti-Union Training Video [video]

#100
What company wishes their employees were unionized? I’ve yet to find an example of management demanding unionization of their free workforce.

Unions, by definition, are strictly about the collective over the individual. You must acquiesce that you have no individual value and qualities that raise you above the minimal employee in order to benefit.

Decisions like Janus are supremely on-point: let unions justify their existence to their own members. Forcing one to join the union as a prerequisite for employment is undeniably immoral and robs employees of free choice.

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