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Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

bppe.ca.gov

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Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#91

Post by wutbrodo »

enraged_camel wrote: post #33
adnzzzzZ wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vetting process and requirements for compliance likely makes it harder for schools who have alternative methods of teaching to be able to experiment and find better solutions to the problem. This pushes innovation in this field out of your state, which you may be okay with as long as people aren't getting swindled. But there's always a cost to these things.

I don't buy these "regulation kills innovation" type arguments. While regulation does put up barriers to entry, it also ensures a baseline level of quality and prevents abuse of the system. I mean there's a reason we don't allow everyone to perform surgery or fly commercial aircraft.

What does manually ensuring a baseline level of quality have to do with innovation? Your comment makes a case for why regulation exists, not a case against the claim that it harms innovation.

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#93

Post by CesareBorgia »

This isn't the first time that the CA regulator (BPPE) has surprised code schools with cease-and-desist letters :)

That said, we (App Academy) found that the BPPE was a mostly accommodating regulator that worked with us to come into compliance. We did face a couple challenges that will likely still exist today:

1) BPPE won't give approval to operate until the whole application process is completed. This means that Lambda School is likely operating without approval and will continue to do so for 6-12 months at a minimum. Contracts are unenforceable during this period, the school could be forced to shut down CA operations overnight, etc.

2) BPPE doesn't have a formal policy for Income Share Agreements (ISAs). We were able to get our ISA approved in 2015, but it took some doing and was not nearly as straightforward as getting a normal tuition contract approved. Several other ISA programs that applied a year or two after us were not approved.

More info: https://venturebeat.com/2014/01/30/california-bootcamp-will-...

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#94

Post by fuzz4lyfe »

zacharycohn wrote: post #72
merpnderp wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

25 lbs of paperwork to register an online school? Sounds less about protecting students and more towards protecting incumbents and cronies.

Or, it serves as an appropriate barrier to prevent people from scamming prospective students out of huge sums of money.

Looking at student loan debt it appears that it was unsuccessful

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#95

Post by anonymous5133 »

joelhaasnoot wrote: post #7
baggy_trough wrote: post #4

Nuts that the state has the right to block this kind of thing. What foolishness is that?

[flagged]

As far as i know TU wasn't a scam. It was simply a real estate focused program.

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#96

Post by rhacker »

What is the purpose of having a law requiring approval for post-secondary education?

Isn't this a trade school? Why in the world does a trade school need this kind of regulation. It just seems like most of our laws are passed in secret you don't know you violated anything until you get hit.

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#97

Post by freetobesmart »

moate wrote: post #24
_Microft wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basically that's Quality Assurance. While Lambda School might be doing good by having the right incentives for all involved parties, a lot of money could be made by tricking people to enroll into questionable schools. So it's for the public good to regulate that market. The question is rather why Lamda School didn't get themselves approved?

Answered elsewhere in thread: Their legal counsel said they didn't need to. The lawyer was wrong, and they now have new legal counsel. Seems like a legit oops which they're since fixed.

lip service. Im not buying it. Maybe they went to their legal counsel and said.

"How do we do this cheaply, how do we get around approval?"

In either case, you have an education company, educating in the tech field making a technical mistake. Not good. Whats the quick fix. Lawyers fault , we got new lawyers.

1) Is there no legal recourse for being lied to by your lawyer?

2) How do they know they hired the right lawyer now? Did they go cheap the first time?

Dont do the same mistake Lambda school did, dont go cheap with your future. Get a real solid education from an accredited institution. Just dont go into too much debt.

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#98

Post by austenallred »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #90
austenallred wrote: post #11

It’s true. Our counsel informed us that we didn’t need to register. Counsel was wrong. Now we have new counsel :) We’ve submitted all the paperwork and have worked closely with California. This all happened a long time ago. I’m not sure what the right level of regulation is (it’s hard taking care of 50 states at once - one state registration was 2,277 pages and weighed 25 pounds https://twitter.com/austen/status/1153…

Sue your old counsel? They will probably settle.

The thing about running a startup is you have enough problems to solve you really don't want to create new ones.

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#99

Post by CesareBorgia »

austenallred wrote: post #92
auvi wrote: post #87

do MOOCs or any online course go through similar regulation?

In theory if they charge for the course they do.

If the course is less than $2k or $3k (can't remember the exact figure), the regulations don't apply. Also, it depends on who the payer is. If the purchasers are solely companies (think corporate training), this regulation doesn't apply.

Re: Lambda School fined $75k by CA for operating without state approval [pdf]

#100

Post by testvox »

rolltiide wrote: post #43
TimTheTinker wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not directing this at you, but to all - this is a concrete example of why you shouldn’t blindly trust legal (or medical, or spiritual) advice. Ask questions, make sure you understand, and think critically. No one is infallible.

I think this is a concrete example of why to blindly trust legal advice. There are some laws explicitly written to say that ignorance of the law is an excuse. "knowing an willing violation" (I don't know if this is one of them though) Taking that to the logical extreme of having a legal opinion with every email puts you in a very privileged situation with the state It exponentially increases the cost of the state to…

Knowingly and willingly usually refers to the level level of awareness that is required to be held culpable for a crime or violation. If the Lambda school was unaware that they were committing the conduct proscribed by law then they would have a defense (assuming knowingly and willingly was the standard required). However they do not need to be aware that the conduct was proscribed by law, just of the the conduct itself.
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