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Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

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Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#91

"For the past 15 years, the efficiency of converting heat into electricity with thermovoltaics has been stalled at 23 percent. But a groundbreaking physical insight has allowed researchers to raise this efficiency to 29 percent. Using a novel design, the researchers are now aiming to reach 50 percent efficiency in the near future by applying well-established scientific concepts." ^interesting part, the drone stuff is…

left out the actual science part of this interesting part: > According to Yablonovitch, this finding builds on work that he and students published in 2011, which found that the key to boosting solar cell efficiency was not by absorbing more photons (light) but emitting them. By adding a highly reflective mirror on the back of a photovoltaic cell, they broke efficiency records at the time and have continued to do so w…

Perhaps a stupid question:

Is this simply a matter of getting a second chance to capture the photon (by the same mechanism) as it makes a second pass through the cell after reflection?

Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#92
post #81
post #77

I really dislike headlines like this on HN that imply that lab research mixed with theory are somehow practical. It would be great if there were a "Theoretically" in there along with removing the hype-included "drone" reference.

Eli Yablonovitch's company, Alta Devices, manufactures a thin film high efficiency PV cell but they can't compete right now against cheap Chinese silicon wafer cells in the solar panel market, so they are focusing on niche markets, primarily drones at first. His 2017 talk to the MIT Energy Initiative ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_K1URyarE0 ) goes into the economics of solar and why his company is using this str…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDxJsa8miNQ has a lot more information on thermophotovoltaics, including drone applications, and some more info on solar panel economics.

Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#93
post #20
post #4

It reads a bit overhyped, considering they claim to power a house with a generator the size of an envelope; that's a hard no since there is a limit on how much energy hits every square meter and it's not THAT much.

That is talking about heat and power cogeneration, not solar power if that's what you're thinking. The paper they site [0] says the density can 300-400kW/m^2 and so at 300kW, 50% efficiency and a small C5 envelope you're looking at over 5kW. [0] https://scholar.google.com/scholar_lookup?author=M.+Bianchi&...

The device is mentioned in this talk (https://youtu.be/lDxJsa8miNQ?t=3105) and provides 1kW of electricity and about 1kW worth of "waste" heat used for hot water. The key idea is that the amount of light would be the equivalent of 280 suns so you don't need a large panel.

Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Forcing over building of” solar is still cheaper than building a new coal or gas plant in some areas. I am positive there are plenty of people who live off grid and do not always need gas or biofuel backup.

>there are plenty of people who live off grid and do not always need gas or biofuel backup. I'm sure there are plenty of such people, but those people don't really factor when you take into account the society as a whole. The vast majority of people and businesses cannot live off grid.

Absolutely agree and vast majority are not economically justified to live off grid in North America. Parent comment used all caps so just pointing out it is not absolute.

Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#95

"For the past 15 years, the efficiency of converting heat into electricity with thermovoltaics has been stalled at 23 percent. But a groundbreaking physical insight has allowed researchers to raise this efficiency to 29 percent. Using a novel design, the researchers are now aiming to reach 50 percent efficiency in the near future by applying well-established scientific concepts." ^interesting part, the drone stuff is…

The solar panel market is dominated by cheap silicon wafer based production from China. This research involves uses of higher efficiency PV in other markets. Thermophotovoltaics have applications in hybrid cars, drones, and cogeneration of electricity. In the conclusion of this talk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDxJsa8miNQ&feature=youtu.be...) Eli Yablonovitch says the automotive market is ten times larger than the solar panel market and is something that higher efficiency PV can target in the near term. Drones are a niche market that Alta Devices is already working in.

Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#97
post #63
post #23

People seem to be misinterpreting this a lot. This is not about solar cells. This is about thermophotovoltalics, and the application here is using a burning fuel source to generate electricity. The "drone" the paper talks about seems to be a reference to another paper on unmanned sea vehicles though. Edit - to be fair the flying drone part is from the corresponding author.

Why couldn't this be used in cars -- 50% seems better than traditional internal combustion engines?

Hybrid cars are potentially their biggest market. Ten times solar PV. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDxJsa8miNQ&feature=youtu.be...

Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#98
post #22
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't about sunlight, but about putting this with a furnace or something else generating heat.

Yes, the original article is about thermophotovoltaics. Regarding the article posted here (and since a drone with a furnace is not feasible) I went with solar.

How about one of the authors talking about a credit-card sized device supplying 100 watts to quad-coptors using liquid fuel and staying airborn for 16+ hours. (https://youtu.be/lDxJsa8miNQ?t=3202)

Re: Drones will fly for days with new photovoltaic engine

#99
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too bad, solar cell don't like much radiation. Add shielding and all mass benefit will be negated.

What about collecting the "waste" IR emissions from the heated water vapor?

No, the whole trick with thermal PV is that you harvest the entire range from thermal infrared to near. A vapour will only glow so so in lower reaches of thermal IR range.
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