Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach • Hacker News Board

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#91

Post by Tycho » Wed, May 01, 2019, 3:48 PM UTC

ChrisSD wrote: post #84

Tycho wrote: post #76

What a disgraceful episode for our governments, the media, and the public who seem to have fallen hook, line and sinker for a blatantly orchestrated smear campaign. I don’t understand what the hell goes through people’s minds when they see such blatantly trumped up and unprovable charges levied against a big-time persona non grata of the CIA/Pentagon and decide to take them at face value. No matter that the US sprung…

He provably skipped bail. EDIT: And tbh I'm not sure how the original arrest warrant for rape could be considered by anyone to be a "technicality".

Well done for missing the point.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#92

Post by ChrisSD » Wed, May 01, 2019, 3:51 PM UTC

Tycho wrote: post #91

ChrisSD wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He provably skipped bail. EDIT: And tbh I'm not sure how the original arrest warrant for rape could be considered by anyone to be a "technicality".

Well done for missing the point.

What is your point then? Sweden were pursuing their original case until he became a fugitive. If he hadn't run, he would (most likely) have been extradited to Sweden, not the US.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#93

Post by SketchySeaBeast » Wed, May 01, 2019, 3:56 PM UTC

SkyBelow wrote: post #86

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm trying to decide if this line of thinking is scary or wondrous.

We can be certain that after the failure of MKUltra, no freedom loving first world government ever engaged in such an experiment again. And even if they had, they surely would have informed us of the fruits of such research if any were found.

Well, no, but I feel like there's a huge jump between that, which clearly was a failure and "we can mind control people now and were going to do it on Assange". If the US were capable of such actions with ease, I feel like we'd see a lot less conflict in the world as political opponents were slowly stifled, and that doesn't seem the case.

Also, what benefit would that have? If the people who Assange truly speaks to are already claiming that he's going to be brainwashed, who does his brainwashing influence? Is there a large group of Wikileaks fence sitters who are arguing that "I'd believe him if he were just a little more mainstream"?

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#94

Post by fit2rule » Wed, May 01, 2019, 4:00 PM UTC

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #87

fit2rule wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The American people should work to de-classify the black sites, and close down Gitmo - only then will the incredible actions of America's ruling elite intelligence classes become fully understood. Yes, read the Wikileaks. Investigate for yourself and move outside the comfortable safety bubble of mainstream mediathink, which makes such acts 'too incredible to be true'. It starts with Wikileaks, but ends with effective…

I didn't get a great answer in regards to your requirements for burden of proof - you didn't expand upon the other evidence or your requirements for accepting these items. I understand and accept that there's a rift between mainstream reporting and what's actually happening, I'm sure we are all aware that not everything is above board, and their IS absolutely secret stuff happening, but if it appears on Wikileaks, do…

Wikileaks is not the one torturing people, dropping bombs on innocent people, committing war crimes on a regular basis.

The people of America, are.

Wikileaks are also not the only ones reporting on all of these acts. Certainly, one must seek multiple sources.

Read the Wikileaks - START there.

But then follow up with Amnesty International, AirWars.org, and any one of a number of other non-state/non-corporate organs of Americas military-industrial-pharmaceutical complex.

>why is Wikileaks a source that's in any way more trustworthy than the mainstream?

"Mainstream" American media is owned by the military-industrial-pharmaceutical complex, who stand to profit greatly from media coverup of its crimes.

It doesn't take much work to discover that truth.

EDIT: Where has Wikileaks ever lied? It has only ever released the facts. Its up to you whether you like those facts, or not .. of course, that depends if you have the temerity to face up to the criminal behaviour that Wikileaks has exposed ..

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#95

Post by CharlesColeman » Wed, May 01, 2019, 4:01 PM UTC

Ettvatre wrote: post #88

CharlesColeman wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Hasn't the crime expired? > No it hasn't. IIRC, a couple of the less serious crimes expired but the most serious one remains prosecutable.

I assume we are talking about rape if we are talking about "the" crime. This is the one the Swedish prosecutor is bringing up again. I'm not sure what other crimes he was suspected to commit.

> I'm not sure what other crimes he was suspected to commit.

The rape charge is the one that's still prosecutable, but he'd previously faced allegations of "sexual molestation" and "unlawful coercion."

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-11949341:

> August 2015 - Swedish prosecutors drop their investigation into two allegations - one of sexual molestation and one of unlawful coercion because they have run out of time to question him. But he still faces the more serious accusation of rape

Edit: This article clarifies the meaning of the other Swedish allegations by quoting them in detail: https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-news/julian-ass...

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#96

Post by inflatableDodo » Wed, May 01, 2019, 4:11 PM UTC

monocasa wrote: post #79

freeflight wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They've done it in countries to which they are way less "aligned" than the UK [0] and the UK has historically been the US's strongest partner on all things "national security/terrorism". In that context, I wouldn't really be surprised if it's happened before, tho the blowback potential, if it should become public, would be massive so it will probably be kept under extremely tight wraps. [0] https://www.opensocietyfou…

For whatever reason, the UK has been extremely against extraordinary rendition despite being aligned with the US. It was a decent sized scandal that rendition flights had even just refueled in Diego Garcia (a UK territory). These sorts of things can't be looked at in terms of broad 'alignment'.

Come on, they also went through Prestwick Airport, just outside Glasgow.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/police-told-to-stay-off-u...

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jun/29/msps-demand-...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-22680924

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#97

Post by SketchySeaBeast » Wed, May 01, 2019, 4:22 PM UTC

fit2rule wrote: post #94

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't get a great answer in regards to your requirements for burden of proof - you didn't expand upon the other evidence or your requirements for accepting these items. I understand and accept that there's a rift between mainstream reporting and what's actually happening, I'm sure we are all aware that not everything is above board, and their IS absolutely secret stuff happening, but if it appears on Wikileaks, do…

Wikileaks is not the one torturing people, dropping bombs on innocent people, committing war crimes on a regular basis. The people of America, are . Wikileaks are also not the only ones reporting on all of these acts. Certainly, one must seek multiple sources. Read the Wikileaks - START there. But then follow up with Amnesty International, AirWars.org, and any one of a number of other non-state/non-corporate organs o…

I understand we have reason to distrust the mainstream monolith, but I don't see why I should trust Wikileaks. You're not providing evidence for, just arguments against. "Because it's not mainstream" gains it nothing. So is Infowars.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#98

Post by Tycho » Wed, May 01, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

ChrisSD wrote: post #92

Tycho wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well done for missing the point.

What is your point then? Sweden were pursuing their original case until he became a fugitive. If he hadn't run, he would (most likely) have been extradited to Sweden, not the US.

The case was ridiculous. The way they pursued it was ridiculous. The way Sweden pursued extradition was ridiculous. The only lens through which it makes any sense is when you realise it’s a ruse to limit or remove his freedom, because he crossed the US government.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#99

Post by foldr » Wed, May 01, 2019, 4:26 PM UTC

guitarbill wrote: post #28

Veen wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You haven't said what is dishonest? Did they do their sums wrong? Did it not cost £16m?

To imply he was responsible or even warranted such an expensive operation is ludicrous. Second, it's bad - but not unexpected - that the US' secret arrest warrant, which it turns out did exist, was not factored in.

Assange is not responsible for deliberately skipping bail?

I'm somewhat shocked by the idea that people should be allowed to get away with breaking the law just because it would be expensive to catch them. I don't think many British people would agree with that attitude.

Re: Julian Assange: Wikileaks co-founder jailed over bail breach

#100

Post by foldr » Wed, May 01, 2019, 4:27 PM UTC

droithomme wrote: post #40

yasp wrote: post #8

Craig Murray's reaction is worth reading [1]. I realize he does not respond to the bail breach directly, but rather to what precipitated this chain of events. > If the Swedish allegations against Julian Assange were genuine and not simply a ruse to arrest him for extradition to the United States, where is the arrest warrant now from Sweden and what are the charges? > Only the more minor allegation has passed the stat…

> In the case of the allegation in Sweden that did fall through the statute of limitation, the accusation was that during the act of consensual sex Julian Assange deliberately split the condom with his fingers, without consent. ... But the split condom given to Swedish police as evidence had none of Assange’s DNA on it – a physical impossibility if he had worn it during sex. And the person making the accusation had p…

This is not a quote from the article? It seems to be taken from Craig Murray's website. Murray is no expert on forensics. See for example his embarrassing analysis here: https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/09/the-impossib...