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Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

nytimes.com

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Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#91

Post by 394549 »

dominotw wrote: post #90
394549 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>> Why so negative. I like how Europeans/Chinese/Everyone stands behind their companies and expect them to succeed globally. USA on other hand is bent on destroying/defaming their own. > uber and lyft deserve it. I use lyft multiple times/week. I don't. Why do you think I should stand behind them, and overlook their ethical lapses, because I'm an American?

What are ethical lapses against lyft? I googled it and found something about spying.

> What are ethical lapses against lyft? I googled it and found something about spying.

I have an answer for that, but you're dodging the question so I won't provide it yet.

Why do you think I should "stand by" American companies like Uber, whose unethical behavior across many different domains is well documented, like you claim the "Europeans/Chinese/Everyone" do with theirs?

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#92

Post by dominotw »

394549 wrote: post #91
dominotw wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are ethical lapses against lyft? I googled it and found something about spying.

> What are ethical lapses against lyft? I googled it and found something about spying. I have an answer for that, but you're dodging the question so I won't provide it yet. Why do you think I should "stand by" American companies like Uber, whose unethical behavior across many different domains is well documented, like you claim the "Europeans/Chinese/Everyone" do with theirs?

> I have an answer for that, but you're dodging the question so I won't provide it yet.

I am not. Your premise for opposition is based on this.

> unethical behavior across many different domains is well documented

which i don't agree with( or I don't have the complete picture).

I use lyft all the time and I have family who are uber drivers. Do you not use uber/lyft?

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#93

Post by dominotw »

drivingmenuts wrote: post #42
394549 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why so negative. I like how Europeans/Chinese/Everyone stands behind their companies and expect them to succeed globally. USA on other hand is bent on destroying/defaming their own. Companies aren't national sports teams. You shouldn't "stand behind them" unless they deserve it.

I would say "earn" rather than deserve (but I live in the US). Once they pass the bar of providing value at a reasonable cost without driving their employees into the ground while simultaneously being ethical, I would say they have earned a small measure of respect.

do you use uber/lyft?

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#94

Post by 394549 »

dominotw wrote: post #92
394549 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What are ethical lapses against lyft? I googled it and found something about spying. I have an answer for that, but you're dodging the question so I won't provide it yet. Why do you think I should "stand by" American companies like Uber, whose unethical behavior across many different domains is well documented, like you claim the "Europeans/Chinese/Everyone" do with theirs?

> I have an answer for that, but you're dodging the question so I won't provide it yet. I am not. Your premise for opposition is based on this. > unethical behavior across many different domains is well documented which i don't agree with( or I don't have the complete picture). I use lyft all the time and I have family who are uber drivers. Do you not use uber/lyft?

I'm trying to get you to unpack your sentiment that Americans should support Uber and Lyft for nationalistic reasons. If you're going to dodge that, we don't really have much to talk about.

> which i don't agree with( or I don't have the complete picture).

I'm thinking it's the latter.

>>>>> uber and lyft deserve it. I use lyft multiple times/week.

> I use lyft all the time and I have family who are uber drivers. Do you not use uber/lyft?

This idea of yours that use or personal utility justifies support of an company is pretty problematic. It's basically the ends justify the means, coupled with a thorough ignorance of and disinterest in the means.

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#95

Post by dominotw »

394549 wrote: post #94
dominotw wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have an answer for that, but you're dodging the question so I won't provide it yet. I am not. Your premise for opposition is based on this. > unethical behavior across many different domains is well documented which i don't agree with( or I don't have the complete picture). I use lyft all the time and I have family who are uber drivers. Do you not use uber/lyft?

I'm trying to get you to unpack your sentiment that Americans should support Uber and Lyft for nationalistic reasons. If you're going to dodge that, we don't really have much to talk about. > which i don't agree with( or I don't have the complete picture). I'm thinking it's the latter. >>>>> uber and lyft deserve it. I use lyft multiple times/week. > I use lyft all the time and I have family who are uber drivers. Do…

> Americans should support Uber and Lyft for nationalistic reasons.

> why do you think I should "stand by" American companies like Uber, whose unethical behavior across many different domains is well documented

Is this the same question?

I will answer the first, Americans should support their local companies because their economic well being depends on it. Same exact reason Chinese support their companies. I want Indians using uber not ola because latter would be of no benefit to me.

Is that a satisfactory response?

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#96

Post by inferiorhuman »

karthikb wrote: post #79
TylerE wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your definition of 'Private' is interesting. Tokyo Metro is owned by... the national and local government.

Tokyo metro is one company of many that provide subway services in Tokyo. There’s also JR, Keisei, and several other companies. Some are fully private, some are joint ventures with the government - but key is that none of these companies have oversight power over themselves.

In theory there is separate oversight over public transit in the United States as well. In California the CPUC regulates, for example, Muni and BART while the CHP has oversight over agencies that use state and federal highways (the subset of the Muni fleet that runs down Van Ness and 19th Ave is under the purview of the CHP). In practice the regulators are feckless.

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#97

Post by CaptainZapp »

karthikb wrote: post #72
giantsloth wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This happened with trains in the 19th century and it was an absolute disaster. Please learn your history on privatized public goods. It results in massive fragmentation in standards, extreme levels of corruption and an overall worse experience for most people.

Suggest that you actually look at privately run transit infrastructure that exists today. Tokyo subway systems (JR, Tokyo Metro, Keisei) - all private. Or Hong Kong - MTR is private. The real problem is putting operations and verification in the same hat - public or private. Private transit systems work well when government regulators have the power to set and enforce a strict SLA. They fail without oversight. Same w…

As a counter example look at privatisation of the UK rail system.

Granted, that not every experience is abyssimal, but in my experience most train riding experiences in the UK are pretty terrible.

Filthy trains with partially massive undercapacity at sky high prices. Delays, cancelled trains and you - the passenger - is just left out to dry.

Infrastructure is also problematic, like an underabundance of ticket machines, let alone ticket selling staff at stations, etc.

It's also interesting to note that Japan rail companies can keep prices reasonable by making major parts of their income via real estate.

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#98

Post by CaptainZapp »

karthikb wrote: post #79
TylerE wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your definition of 'Private' is interesting. Tokyo Metro is owned by... the national and local government.

Tokyo metro is one company of many that provide subway services in Tokyo. There’s also JR, Keisei, and several other companies. Some are fully private, some are joint ventures with the government - but key is that none of these companies have oversight power over themselves.

Not to nitpick. But JR is not really one company, even though you get the impression that it is, due to the homogenity of, for example signage, partially quite comparable rolling stock and a shared (extremely efficient) reservation system.

From Wikipedia: [1]

The Japan Railways Group, more commonly known as JR Group (JRグループ Jeiāru Gurūpu), consists of seven for-profit companies that took over most of the assets and operations of the government-owned Japanese National Railways on April 1, 1987. Most of the liability of the JNR was assumed by the JNR Settlement Corporation.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Railways_Group

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#99

Post by michaelmrose »

notarealaccount wrote: post #34
abhiminator wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>started sharing your data with 3rd parties as an additional way to monetize. Germany's national broadcaster Deutsche Welle produced an excellent documentary looking at the exact same scenario you described. [0] It looked into the possibility of making short-haul transportation (focusing primarily on Hyperloop) virtually free with just one caveat: a precondition that users share all their private data that advertiser…

Am I the only one who wouldn't mind a responsible way for people to target me with things I don't know about which I might be interested in?

Information not vetted by the user is often pretty inaccurate even with the best of intentions. If the user is allowed to vet it obviously it wont contain anything bad about the user including info people may ultimately desire to have.

All the information collected in service of figuring out what to advertise to you will ultimately be used for all sorts of things many of which could be to your disadvantage.

In the end you wont even know why you were denied that car loan, that job, that place to live, why you weren't deemed credible by the cops or why you were sentenced to the maximum instead of offered probation. The oracle just told the car company, the employer, the landlord, the cops, and the prosecutor what to do at different junctures based decisions that not even the people running the computer can fully explain.

Re: Lyft and Uber Won’t Be Happy Until They’re Your One-Stop Transit Guide

#100

Post by drivingmenuts »

dominotw wrote: post #93
drivingmenuts wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say "earn" rather than deserve (but I live in the US). Once they pass the bar of providing value at a reasonable cost without driving their employees into the ground while simultaneously being ethical, I would say they have earned a small measure of respect.

do you use uber/lyft?

No. Uber has enough ethical issues that I wrote them off long ago.

Both of them went through some foofaraw with the City of Austin (I live there) that, when they cancelled their services, I decided I could live without them.

Plus, I have a perfectly workable car and a dislike of being in something that "not my vehicle". It's a boundary thing.

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