Live data from Hacker News

Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

bbc.com

91–100 of 380 posts

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#91
post #50
post #9

Why wouldn't it be? It's faster than the tram; a bike is cheap and cycling is free; its way easier to park than a car; its healthy; there are cycle paths everywhere (inside and between cities); and everyone else does it, so you usually have company.

While cycling is obviously much, much cheaper than a car, I'd argue its a myth to say it's 'free'. Start commuting a _reasonable_ distance regularly by bike and you are going to incur running costs, as well as often not insignificant investment in essential accessories you might need depending on where you live - clothing, panniers, lights, helmets, locks... There's a fair amount of things on a bike that, like many o…

> essential accessories - clothing, panniers, lights, helmets, locks, new tires and tubes, CO2 cartridges, chains, cassettes, lubricant, wheels (eventually), brake pads/disks.

Mine came with a lock and lights. Tires last 10 years and aren't that expensive. Pumping tires has to happen a few times a year, come on. Never replaced a chain before the rest of the bike was due for replacement anyway. Never heard of anyone replacing cassettes. Lubricant is not expensive for how much it's needed (a euro a year maybe). New brake pads aren't expensive and they last years, disks last decades no idea how expensive they are (my bike from high school still doesn't need to have them replaced). Never used a pannier. Never wore a helmet that I can remember (I've had this discussion before here... I don't know anyone who wore one, nor anyone who sustained serious injury due to not wearing one). And special clothing, huh? What's wrong with the clothes you're wearing?

You're greatly exaggerating. The only expensive part is buying a good one when it's new.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#92
I'm Dutch, but think we tend to underestimate the impact of the flatness of our country, and the size of other countries especially the States. I've cycled on my normal 7-gear bicycle (and that might be considered fancy) from Newcastle to Carlisle. Which is quite flat. I had to walk so much up hill as it was utterly impossible to climb 40 meters.

In the Netherlands quite a lot of people do live in a 50 km radius of their workplace. And 50 km would be a distance you'll travel by train or car. A daily comute of more then one hour in the Netherlands might be considered 'quite a while' but I guess this is different in the USA.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#93
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get it - that competition is of bike thefts for unguarded and _unlocked_ bikes. Surely it means nothing. Do people not buy bike locks in those regions? Is it typical for a 13mm+ Ulock in Amsterdam to get broken?

> Surely it means nothing Well I guess it means that you can't leave your bike unlocked in parts of Amsterdam, which is a shame.

You can't leave your bike unlocked anywhere. Ever. At anytime. How come this isn't the initial reasoning? In fact, you can't leave anything unattended or not secured. This goes for cars, bikes, luggage, homes, i don't know what else.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#94
post #91
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While cycling is obviously much, much cheaper than a car, I'd argue its a myth to say it's 'free'. Start commuting a _reasonable_ distance regularly by bike and you are going to incur running costs, as well as often not insignificant investment in essential accessories you might need depending on where you live - clothing, panniers, lights, helmets, locks... There's a fair amount of things on a bike that, like many o…

> essential accessories - clothing, panniers, lights, helmets, locks, new tires and tubes, CO2 cartridges, chains, cassettes, lubricant, wheels (eventually), brake pads/disks. Mine came with a lock and lights. Tires last 10 years and aren't that expensive. Pumping tires has to happen a few times a year, come on. Never replaced a chain before the rest of the bike was due for replacement anyway. Never heard of anyone r…

You've edited my post rather substantially to suit your own end in your "quote" - at no point does my original post describe that entire list as essential - I merely gave examples of the kind of things that _can_ need maintenance.

> Tires last 10 years and aren't that expensive

> New brake pads aren't expensive and they last years

Ride 20 miles a day and lifespans like these are nigh on impossible. Especially if you have inclement weather to deal with.

> Never heard of anyone replacing cassettes.

Cassette lifespan is entirely dependent on maintenance, but if you abuse your bike you will find the derailleur starts 'jumping' on shifts after 400-600 miles or so. For me, this is every 3 or 4 months. They are designed as consumable parts, not unlike car brakes. This is one of several reasons why single speed bikes make great commuters if you can push a reasonable sized gear.

> And special clothing, huh? What's wrong with the clothes you're wearing?

What you are wearing is often not great if cycling in rain, snow or ice. Sitting at my desk in rain drenched, puddle stained clothing is never much fun. Similarly, many people understandably don't want to wear the clothes they sweated in for 10 miles on the way to work for a full day at the office...

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#95
post #20

Aren't cars really expensive to purchase in the Netherlands? Also, pushing biking at the expense of cars certainly helps. People in the US would go nuts if the Government starting reducing car lanes to install dedicated bike lanes.

Came here to say the same. A car + insurance + gas = very expensive.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#96
post #10

A couple of other factors; I don't think the Netherlands has ever had more than a tiny car or oil industry.

Oh, they had a big oil industry. So much so that the term "Dutch disease" refers to what happens when oil dominates an economy.

That was natural gas from the Groningen fields, but Rotterdam has a giant refinery.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#97
post #68
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> its way easier to park than a car On the other hand it’s also easier to get a bike stolen than a car.

Anecdotal: I've had more cars than bikes stolen (6 cars, two bikes if you include my daughter's).

6 cars stolen! You live in Mogadishu or something?

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#98
post #81
post #47

> If anything, having a tatty, battered old > bike affords more status as it attests to > a long and lasting love. As an Amsterdam resident: What a romantic characterization of our high crime rates! Yes, the reason I still ride a shitty old beater of a bike is definitely my long lasting love for that piece of shit, it's not because I know that if I buy anything fancy I'm going to have to never take my eyes off of it,…

I don't get it - that competition is of bike thefts for unguarded and _unlocked_ bikes. Surely it means nothing. Do people not buy bike locks in those regions? Is it typical for a 13mm+ Ulock in Amsterdam to get broken?

I've had three bikes stolen in about three months time. Each time, I used what was considered a high-end lock. I was usually more bummed out at losing the lock because they cost me more than the bike.

The best strategy, I find, is to avoid leaving the bike in theft 'hot spots', especially in the weekend. If that can't be avoided, make sure to put the bike behind another bike, preferable a fancy one or one with a shitty lock.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#99
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are many factors, but IMO it has a lot to do with urban sprawl. I'd never consider living somewhere where I'd have to own a car to be able to do my groceries and to go work. In the same idea, I'd never take a job that requires me to do more than a 30 minutes commute by public transportation/biking distance. That makes me a perfect candidate for biking, unfortunately I'm more of an outlier. Most people, includin…

> Just look at any suburbs: the inhabitants clearly disagree with me. Some of us just have kids and have noticed that all the city housing is either incredibly expensive or in slums, and the schools in the city proper are dangerous and terrible so we'd also have to pay for private school[0]. And we're not made of money. I'd much rather live in the city—I hate the car-centric lifestyle—but living there if I have enoug…

That's a chicken-and-egg problem too... inner-city schools suck because everyone with money took their taxes to the suburbs (for better schools).

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#100
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Surely it means nothing Well I guess it means that you can't leave your bike unlocked in parts of Amsterdam, which is a shame.

You can't leave your bike unlocked anywhere. Ever. At anytime. How come this isn't the initial reasoning? In fact, you can't leave anything unattended or not secured. This goes for cars, bikes, luggage, homes, i don't know what else.

our brave total surveillance future does have this silver lining!
Post reply on HN