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Apple’s China Problem

stratechery.com

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Re: Apple’s China Problem

#91

Post by valuearb »

vanilla_nut wrote: post #84

>Unsurprisingly, in stark contrast to the rest of the world, according to a report earlier this year only 50% of iPhone users who bought another phone in 2016 stayed with Apple: At first, I was confused by this graphic. Then I realized that the author is dramatically misinterpreting it: the graphic actually means that 66.85% of phones purchased in 2015 were made by Apple and 50% of phones purchased in 2016 were made…

Somehow you didn't notice the graph added up to 250%, and you snark that the author needs to brush up on statistics?

Please explain how 50 of 250 is actually 50% of everything. Especially when the author writes iPhone sales are only 9.6% of the chinese market.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#92

Post by valuearb »

marktangotango wrote: post #9
staticelf wrote: post #2

> None of that lock-in exists in China: Apple may be a de facto monopolist for most of the world, but in China the company is simply another smartphone vendor, and being simply another smartphone vendor is a hazardous place to be. Don't get that part. I live in Europe and sure a lot of people has an iPhone but I believe strongly that more people have an Android. Doesn't Android have like 80% or more of the world mark…

The article contradicts itself; it says there's a problem, but in the long term, that iphone being 'status conferring' will ultimately prevail, meaning nullify the "problem", not become dominant necessarily: > iPhone users very rarely switch to Android, while a fair number of Android users switch to iPhone, which means that even in a saturated market Apple’s share should grow over time. > And to be sure, an iPhone is…

If you think status is why Apple succeeds, you don't really understand the PC or smartphone markets.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#93

Post by anjc »

valuearb wrote: post #85
anjc wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Differentiation also has a precise meaning in literature, and just feeling that software which comes free with Apple hardware is better than other software doesn't indicate product differentiation or a differentiation strategy. That's just personal preference. I'm not saying that you don't/shouldn't genuinely and rightly prefer Apple software, I use Apple devices every day myself. That being said, I'd hazard a guess…

Yea, you don't understand the definition of product differentiation or differentiation strategy, because iOS and MacOS are poster children for both. You also don't understand that MacOS isn't designed to be a commodity OS that runs on any hardware. It doesn't install with a huge database of video drivers for every possible PC out there. Running MacOS on generic hardware is problematic and not worthwhile, especially w…

Yeah, I understand exactly what the definitions of them are in detail, and somebody saying "It's differentiated because I like it better", which is what the person I replied to wrote, doesn't fit under the definitions.

I never said that attributes of Apple's product lines can't be classed as 'differentiated'.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#94

Post by archvile »

gnrlist wrote: post #56

Chinese people want the Apple brand they don't care about iOS. If iOS was the status symbol it would get pirated and installed elsewhere. Apple has a strong brand because of it's history as a premium device company internationally, that's all. Their brand was their first mover advantage in China but now Chinese companies are closing that brand gap and since WeChat rules the software side Apple is going to have a hard…

How would iOS get pirated when the only way to install it is by using a certificate that only Apple holds? If it was easy enough to reverse engineer iOS and remove that install requirement, I'm sure it would have been done by now.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#95

Post by petra »

skdotdan wrote: post #53

The problem with many tech analysts is that they are Apple fanboys without even knowing that they are. Stating that Microsoft Surface and Samsung S8 are not competitors of Apple just because their products don't run Mac OS/iOS is pure fanaticism at the very least. Nevertheless, I find that the main point of the article is right. But Apple's China problem is also a very important problem for Google (actually, it's wor…

>> The problem with many tech analysts is that they are Apple fanboys without even knowing that they are.

That's true for most of the discussion on the internet: so much talk about how Apple's chips/apps/ui/build-quality/founders/etc are so much better.

But almost no talk at all about how modern brands get built, and what such brands give to users: for example, the ability to tell stories(implicitly or explicitly) to themselves and others, stories that make them feel good about themselves.

And i don't think it's fair to demand those users to forefit that right, after they paid so much for it.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#96

Post by zeveb »

valuearb wrote: post #77
zeveb wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> neither of them run macOS, and that's probably a dealbreaker for me I strongly suggest that you give Linux a shot. Depending on the distro, it can be very nice, and it means that you get to keep both your money and your freedom, which I really appreciate.

Applications matter.

You're not wrong, but all the applications I care about run on Linux:

- emacs

- vi

- zsh

- st

- SBCL

- tmux

- Inkscape

- sxiv

- Firefox

- Gnucash

- GraphicsMagick

- Nethack

- Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup

- Minecraft

Of those, only Minecraft isn't developed on Linux first (and maybe Firefox, depending on how you define that condition).

I can be productive. I can read email (in emacs, of course!). I can play games. I can read documents. I can browse the Web. I feel as though my needs have been met.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#97

Post by nullnilvoid »

gnrlist wrote: post #56

Chinese people want the Apple brand they don't care about iOS. If iOS was the status symbol it would get pirated and installed elsewhere. Apple has a strong brand because of it's history as a premium device company internationally, that's all. Their brand was their first mover advantage in China but now Chinese companies are closing that brand gap and since WeChat rules the software side Apple is going to have a hard…

Other than the brand factor, iPhone is actually a better phone. Before the current iPhone I have, I had always been an Android user. I used entry-level Android phones, high-end Android phones such as Samsung Galaxy, iPhone is clearly a better phone. iOS feels more smooth, reliable, battery-efficient in many ways than Android phones. Honestly, I have not looked back since the switch.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#98

Post by imron »

zeveb wrote: post #76
imron wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but I believe strongly that more people have an Android. If you go by people, Android has more market share. If you go by profit, iOS has more market share. https://www.macrumors.com/2017/03/07/apple-global-smartphone... > None of that lock-in exists in China This is true. If all your friends and family use iMessage and PhotoStream, then once you start using that too it creates lock-in specifically tied to software…

> As an example, all my family use iPhones. We use PhotoStream to share pictures of family events and children and the like. If I were to switch to Android then I would lose all of that interaction, and so it's a big driver in keeping me (and other family members) on iOS. There's always Flickr, Facebook &c. Many folks in my family use iCloud or PhotoStream or whatever it's called, and it does mean that I'm cut out of…

> There's always Flickr, Facebook &c.

I don't use Facebook. Privacy concerns are another reason why I use iOS over Android.

Re: Apple’s China Problem

#99

Post by anjc »

valuearb wrote: post #86
anjc wrote: post #32

> hardware differentiated by software such that said hardware can be sold with a margin much greater than nominal competitors running a commodity operating system. Apple's hardware is not differentiated by software. Their creaking software is an ancillary requirement to use their excellent hardware. If their software was their differentiator then Hackintosh's would be more widely used. Secondly, OSX is a commodity op…

By your logic, if Windows was a good enough OS to be a differentiator, everyone would just build their own PCs to save a hundred bucks. Because everyone has the free time, inclination, and skills to build one, and everyone enjoys tinkering with their PCs when they don't run right, instead of actually getting work done.

No it'd be more like "if Windows was a good enough OS, people would go to efforts to install it on computers that aren't made for it" (Bootcamp?).

But either way, neither OSX or Windows are "differentiators". Attributes might differentiate the products in a theoretical sense, for example branding, pricing, licensing, support, ease of use, but there's effectively only 3 widely used operating systems so it's senseless to talk about differentiation as a concept. With that low level of competition you're just talking about 'different'.

Redhat is an example of an OS that you could call 'differentiated' due to their business model and niche usage.

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