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Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

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Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#91

Post by Eerie »

olivermarks wrote: post #79
samstave wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The year is 2051, SpaceX has made significant progress on building out infrastructure on mars. In the last 25 years we have seen the explosion of Musk's empire across the solar system. Starting with the seed efforts on earth, robotic rockets have been flowing to Mars in droves. The exceptional thing is how they have delivered the infrastructure to the planet once there. These rockets are far superior to their ancesto…

aah, there's nothing like utopian geek idealism...

Much better than the hollow cynicism of your post, though...

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#92

Post by kornish »

GCA10 wrote: post #57
Blackthorn wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every budding short seller needs to, at some point in their career, learn the lesson of never shorting a growth tech stock.

Yes. Short-selling pioneer Bob Wilson nailed the key insight on these situations. They are "manana stocks," Wilson declared, way back in the 1970s. Their valuation is premised on the notion that something wonderful will happen in the future. Time horizons keep being pushed out, but the stocks' fans don't mind. Shorts can get very cranky and righteous about each little bit of slippage. But as long as new enthusiasts k…

"The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent." – John Maynard Keynes

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#94

Post by nwhatt »

spyspy wrote: post #41
laurent123456 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't short the stock but I can understand why someone would. They are expected to generate over 90% of their value after 2020 [0]. There's the expectation that Elon Musk will definitely deliver, that Tesla market share will not be eaten up by other carmakers when they seriously start releasing electric vehicles. The expectation that electric and not another form of energy, such as hydrogen, will dominate, etc. Th…

> when they seriously start releasing electric vehicles They've been "serious" for a long time. Chevy has been selling the Volt since 2010. If they were going to muscle out Tesla they would have done it by now. And it's not just about technology. Tesla has the customer reputation that companies like GM will never have again.

GM isn't a threat to tesla unless Cadillac starts selling something to compete with the model S. As a Tesla shareholder what keeps me up at night are Mercedes, BMW, and Lexus.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#95

Post by M_Grey »

jpeg_hero wrote: post #2

Tesla shorts can't get a break. First a smooth $1B+ capital raise without a stock hiccup and now this.

Over the next year or so, it should be clear if they'll be left in the cold, or very wealthy. Pretty much everyone seems to agree that the Model 3 needs to do well in an unprecedented way (not impossible), or Tesla is in very deep trouble (not impossible). It's hard to imagine the BMW and Mercedes aren't working on things too, and they won't have horror stories of their cars being in the shops for the better part of a year.

This is still so uncertain, and I for one wouldn't feel comfortable even guessing, never mind guessing with real money.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#96

Post by greglindahl »

Cerium wrote: post #45
jonknee wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They changed their name because they bought Elon's solar company (which was also not a tech company).

I'm curious about what you would consider a tech company. For me a tech company is any company that uses the development of technology as a competitive advantage. Solar is not, major solar companies are not developing innovative technology. Tesla is, they do not have an advantage in scale or low prices, but have advantage in how their vehicles function.

So you don't think that 3d printing solar roof tiles is innovative solar technology? I don't think anyone else is talking about that.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#97

Post by kbenson »

timr wrote: post #65
Robotbeat wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole point of advertising is to make something popular that isn't already or to maintain popularity for something that would otherwise decline in popularity. As long as all GM is doing is sniping at other electric cars while doing general broad-based advertising of their fossil fuel powered vehicles, they're not lifting a finger to expand the EV market. I wouldn't worry about Tesla, anyway. Tesla has huge brand…

"The whole point of advertising is to make something popular that isn't already or to maintain popularity for something that would otherwise decline in popularity." You can't push on a string. Consumers buy bigger cars when gas prices are low, and more efficient cars when gas prices are high. It's why Toyota (which has built a brand identity around fuel efficiency) does worse when fuel prices go down. Marketing can i…

> Marketing can influence consumers' affinity for brands and perception of product quality. It can't change economics.

Actually, I would say marketing is one of the few things that actually can change economics, since it affects perception. Marketing can make someone think they need a new car when they don't, or that a car is affordable than an alternative when it really isn't (given financing, fuel economy, services, etc which are not always taken into account).

People don't make decisions based on reality, they make decisions based on their perception of reality. If you can change that perception, you may change their decisions.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#98

Post by timr »

kbenson wrote: post #97
timr wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The whole point of advertising is to make something popular that isn't already or to maintain popularity for something that would otherwise decline in popularity." You can't push on a string. Consumers buy bigger cars when gas prices are low, and more efficient cars when gas prices are high. It's why Toyota (which has built a brand identity around fuel efficiency) does worse when fuel prices go down. Marketing can i…

> Marketing can influence consumers' affinity for brands and perception of product quality. It can't change economics. Actually, I would say marketing is one of the few things that actually can change economics, since it affects perception . Marketing can make someone think they need a new car when they don't, or that a car is affordable than an alternative when it really isn't (given financing, fuel economy, service…

You can make all the theoretical arguments you want, but the fact remains: when gas prices go up, sales of trucks and SUVs goes down. And vice-versa.

You think car companies want to change their assembly lines and tooling, if they can magically change consumer buying habits with a bit of advertising? Come on.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#99

Post by debaserab2 »

jonknee wrote: post #42
bredren wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of company would you call it?

Every company these days is a tech company in some respects, but I don't think Tesla fits the bill in the general sense. Tesla is a green energy manufacturing company. The only reason I think this matters is their finances are a lot different than a tech company. You are correct that Tesla is currently priced like a tech company though, so maybe I'm way off!

..so what is a tech company then?

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#100

Post by olivermarks »

Eerie wrote: post #91
olivermarks wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

aah, there's nothing like utopian geek idealism...

Much better than the hollow cynicism of your post, though...

"In the last 25 years we have seen the explosion of Musk's empire across the solar system. " - you have to admit that is pretty funny...
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