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They Used To Last 50 Years

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Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#91

Post by lacampbell »

MichaelBurge wrote: post #70
tomlock wrote: post #48

Isn't this largely driven by consumer demand? The prices of appliances has dropped dramatically in the last few decades. Building a long-lasting appliance often requires even marginally more expensive materials - many of which are highlighted in this article. If consumers are primarily price sensitive at the time of purchase, they may choose the $50 cheaper appliance even if it lasts 40 years less. What I mean to sug…

Around 40%[1] of the population rents, which means 40% doesn't make the purchasing decision for many appliances. We can sanity-check your argument with this: That reasoning should predict no change in the quality of commercial appliances used in apartment complexes and laundromats, since these customers are used to making spreadsheets with a capital expenditures budget that they pay into for 30 years. [1] http://www.…

Around 40%[1] of the population rents, which means 40% doesn't make the purchasing decision for many appliances.

Do all rental properties come with appliances in the US? Here in NZ that's the exception rather than the rule.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#92

Post by lobster_johnson »

There's a subreddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/BuyItForLife/) trying to track objects that don't suffer from planned obsolescence. Not a lot of appliances there, though.

The article seems very US-centric, and doesn't mention European brands such as Miele, Bosch, Siemens and Jura (coffee machines), all of which are wholly owned and produce high-quality stuff.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#93

Post by snotrockets »

MakeUsersWant wrote: post #75
snotrockets wrote: post #58

This isn't the first piece to claim that new appliances, and cars, and other manufactured goods, are made to lower standards as a conspiracy to sell more. But planned obsolescence isn't a conspiracy, it's a design requirement: there is a requirement to reduce costs, at a greater rate than reduce in production cost due to advancements in manufacturing and logistics. That reduction in cost can not come from thin air, s…

Will the $5000 fridge last 20 years? How do I know the manufactor isn't lying?

Another reason to buy a $500 fridge.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#95

Post by chrisseaton »

autokad wrote: post #83
chrisseaton wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why's mechanical better? Mechanics stick, break, become worn out. A circuit generally doesn't, does it? I know capacitors burst but they're easy enough to change. Do components like ICs ever just stop working? I would have thought solid-state would be better for endurance.

touch pads have high failure rates. if they don't go, the control board does. and if neither, the connection between them. as for easy to change, replacing the mother board on my refrigerator would cost 600$ without installation fees. guess who bought a new refrigerator? :(

I know it happens, but how does a mother board just die? I mean it's a piece of plastic with durable metal channels on it. The channels don't wear or burn out. Everything's just inert. I know some components like capacitors do die, but they can be tested and replaced. How can a mother board just stop working?

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#96

Post by markbnj »

psadauskas wrote: post #40
prodmerc wrote: post #8

I've worked on hundreds of domestic appliances. Newer ones from any manufacturer are indeed failing more often, and are designed worse. The only explanation is that this is on purpose - just like cars or laptops or smartphones, they are designed to fail faster so you buy new ones. Planned obsolescence, plain and simple. The best appliances today, by the way, are made by Bosch/Siemens and Miele. None of the other manu…

"The only explanation..."? What about "never attribute to malice..." and Occam's Razor. I think a more likely explanation is that in the majority of cases when shopping for an appliance and your choices are a $1500 one and a $2000 one, you buy the cheaper one. This forces manufacturers to compete on price, and to cut costs wherever possible to remain profitable. Additionally, I just spent 30 seconds googling and a wa…

Came here to ask how the author could write that entire piece and not compare costs.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#97

Post by jacquesm »

WalterBright wrote: post #78

The oldest appliance I have in regular use is my Carver amplifier bought in 1980 or so. I use it all day every day. That's nearly 40 years now :-) In "bang for the buck", it's the best purchase I ever made.

I bought an amp from the 80's for $50 or thereabouts that still works like new. Nothing new would have come close to the value I'm getting from that thing and it still works like a charm.

The really surprising thing to me is that the caps are all still good, I fully expected those to give way on first power up and that's now 5 years ago.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#98

Post by awful »

My experience is: they use cheap, tiny bi-metals in several places in fridge, which fail in no time at all, instead of a real relay/timer. This is a cost reduction of maybe a few dollars - for them this means a lot of money because of quantity, but for me an inexcusable corner cut; the only conclusion is planned obsolescence, or at the least pay the repair tax. On my washer I have had to keep the lid open to prevent rust, and the lid switch I had to reinforce as in the article. Among others; I have personally kept all my appliances including furnaces running for many decades and all the failures have been because of this kind of nonsense.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#99

Post by jacquesm »

nickhalfasleep wrote: post #9

A coworker was raving about their refrigerator from New Zealand as being against this trend: https://www.fisherpaykel.com/

What's really good about those is the motor.

They're one of the first pancake motor users in appliances and because of the extremely short unsupported section of shaft are next to indestructible if not abused.

I've seen people scouring dumps for those for some hobby project or other (windmill, hometrainer, electric go-cart...).

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#100

Post by coldsmoke »

psadauskas wrote: post #40
prodmerc wrote: post #8

I've worked on hundreds of domestic appliances. Newer ones from any manufacturer are indeed failing more often, and are designed worse. The only explanation is that this is on purpose - just like cars or laptops or smartphones, they are designed to fail faster so you buy new ones. Planned obsolescence, plain and simple. The best appliances today, by the way, are made by Bosch/Siemens and Miele. None of the other manu…

"The only explanation..."? What about "never attribute to malice..." and Occam's Razor. I think a more likely explanation is that in the majority of cases when shopping for an appliance and your choices are a $1500 one and a $2000 one, you buy the cheaper one. This forces manufacturers to compete on price, and to cut costs wherever possible to remain profitable. Additionally, I just spent 30 seconds googling and a wa…

Not only that, but people also _want_ to buy new appliances, since they actually become better. More silent, less power drain, more features, etc. So if everyone buys new stuff every ten years or so anyway, why bother building stuff that lasts fifty since that undoubtedly is more expensive.
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