This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University • Hacker News Board

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#91

Post by Overtonwindow » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 1:59 PM UTC

jccalhoun wrote: post #67

rubidium wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having spent far more than my fair share of time around University students (11 years), I can assure you that the complaint is likely what the student said. It smells very much like what students today are saying. Remember the other professor who had students call the police because there were mice in their apartment?

"Having spent far more than my fair share of time around University students (11 years), I can assure you that the complaint is likely what the student said. It smells very much like what students today are saying." I guess I have different students because I've been teaching college since 2000 and have never had any complaints like this and neither have any of my friends.

What subject do you teach? I was talking to an old physics professor of mine and he said the same thing, but my former psych professor was completely the opposite. Maybe it's a subject-related issue?

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#92

Post by SeanDav » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:00 PM UTC

sago wrote: post #6

I think the world would be better if, before you're allowed to respond to someone being wrong, you have to first be able to express their position in a way that they agree represents their view. Because 'political correctness' isn't the cancer at the heart of social politics, it is straw-manning. On both sides of every issue. I'd be surprised, perhaps even amazed, if Dr Piper had represented the complaint in any way…

A little research will produce a vast number of examples of political correctness with real consequences and not just "straw-manning".

Here is a recent example: A Canadian university cancels a yoga class because yoga comes "from a culture that “experienced oppression, cultural genocide and diasporas due to colonialism and western supremacy,”

In a world that can do that, I don't find it surprising that a student could express the view in the original article and actually mean it.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#93

Post by MollyR » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:00 PM UTC

jccalhoun wrote: post #67

rubidium wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having spent far more than my fair share of time around University students (11 years), I can assure you that the complaint is likely what the student said. It smells very much like what students today are saying. Remember the other professor who had students call the police because there were mice in their apartment?

"Having spent far more than my fair share of time around University students (11 years), I can assure you that the complaint is likely what the student said. It smells very much like what students today are saying." I guess I have different students because I've been teaching college since 2000 and have never had any complaints like this and neither have any of my friends.

Probably depends on the school, I've saw it as a student, but I have friends from engineering colleges who said they didn't see much of it.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#94

Post by afandian » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:00 PM UTC

frobozz wrote: post #61

sago wrote: post #6

I think the world would be better if, before you're allowed to respond to someone being wrong, you have to first be able to express their position in a way that they agree represents their view. Because 'political correctness' isn't the cancer at the heart of social politics, it is straw-manning. On both sides of every issue. I'd be surprised, perhaps even amazed, if Dr Piper had represented the complaint in any way…

Indeed. Either the complainant is a troll, or doesn't exist. No normal person would attend a sermon at the chapel of a given faith, and complain that the sermon victimises them for being a poor practitioner of that faith. This is doubly true when its about something universal like love, rather than how well you practice some specific ritual.

I don't know about your definition of 'normal' but I've seen plenty of videos recently (they tend to surface when things like the recent Yale activity happen) that have reminded me that there are people with views so irreconcilably far from my own that there's no point trying to second-guess what views anyone would or wouldn't hold.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#95

Post by coldpie » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:01 PM UTC

wmichelin wrote: post #5

I think that this article is fantastic. It highlights what is wrong with all the political correctness going on. To an extent, it is necessary. People shouldn't be made to feel bad about race, gender, or sexuality, but once you start to coddle them, you aren't helping them grow as individuals. People in the real world will treat you like crap, no matter what.

> People in the real world will treat you like crap, no matter what.

Why should we accept this?

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#96

Post by SolaceQuantum » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:01 PM UTC

madaxe_again wrote: post #62

cJ0th wrote: post #11

"I like to offend people, because I think that everyone who gets offended, should be offended." -- Linus Torvalds

One takes offence, one does not give it. It's an idiopathic condition. I'm a white male, but I grew up being called Gwailo, Gaijin, Auslander, and when I finally returned to the anglosphere in my early teens, I was still an outsider as I spoke with a weird accent and was by that point a through-and-through third culture kid. I got the crap bullied out of me, and eventually figured out that it only hurt if I took it t…

> and this is why we have criminal justice systems which typically take this sort of thing perfectly seriously

I hate to break it to you but there are some serious issues with the justice system. In usa at least.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#97

Post by hueving » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:01 PM UTC

maaku wrote: post #21

lagadu wrote: post #3

I find it baffling that there are people, in the real world, who somehow think that for unexplained reasons they have the right to not be offended or be made to feel uncomfortable. Somehow they believe that their feelings are the responsibility of everyone else.

While I sympathize with your viewpoint, perhaps I can shed some clarity on the other side. The concern is not feelings getting hurt, but rather physical security as a person of minority status. This is something that a white heterosexual middle-class male (such as myself) can probably never fully appreciate, but I try to sympathize. Imagine what it is like to be black in a country where just a few generations back yo…

This makes absolutely no sense. Plenty of Jewish people went to college in the last 50 years and did not request that the Holocaust be left out of history classes because it 'triggered' them.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#98

Post by lagadu » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:02 PM UTC

frobozz wrote: post #61

sago wrote: post #6

I think the world would be better if, before you're allowed to respond to someone being wrong, you have to first be able to express their position in a way that they agree represents their view. Because 'political correctness' isn't the cancer at the heart of social politics, it is straw-manning. On both sides of every issue. I'd be surprised, perhaps even amazed, if Dr Piper had represented the complaint in any way…

Indeed. Either the complainant is a troll, or doesn't exist. No normal person would attend a sermon at the chapel of a given faith, and complain that the sermon victimises them for being a poor practitioner of that faith. This is doubly true when its about something universal like love, rather than how well you practice some specific ritual.

Much like no true Scotsman would do such a thing?

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#99

Post by CIPHERSTONE » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:02 PM UTC

facetube wrote: post #52

rlpb wrote: post #32

"As an evangelical Christian university of The Wesleyan Church, Oklahoma Wesleyan University models a way of thought, a way of life, and a way of faith. It is a place of serious study, honest questions, and critical engagement, all in the context of a liberal arts community that honors the Primacy of Jesus Christ, the Priority of Scripture, the Pursuit of Truth, and the Practice of Wisdom." This sounds to me more lik…

If nothing else, it sounds like it's definitely a safe space for mythology.

This made me laugh. Well played.

Re: This Is Not a Day Care. It’s a University

#100

Post by venomsnake » Tue, Dec 01, 2015, 2:02 PM UTC

philh wrote: post #56

This seems to be thrusting in two directions. One about trigger warnings and safe spaces and so on, and one about sermons and guilt. One common narrative re safe spaces seems to be: "if something makes you uncomfortable, you should suck it up instead of trying to force everyone else to accommodate you". I think this is somewhat missing the point, but I can relate to it. I feel like this is the dominant narrative in t…

> For example, if the sermon was all about how gay people are going to hell, and that made a student uncomfortable, that's not because the student is a bad person. That's because it was a terrible sermon.

Well, no - the proper response to that is not whining but saying:

"Since in hell are probably also Freddie Mercury, Voltaire and Oscar Wilde (and probably Mark Twain) - do I strictly have to be gay to go there or are there other ways I could take" and enjoy the show.

There is no greater weapon against powerful people that take themselves seriously than mocking them and their beliefs.