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Bootstrap 4 alpha

blog.getbootstrap.com

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Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#91

Post by JuanSoto »

at-fates-hands wrote: post #63
bluetidepro wrote: post #22

One amazing thing to note is that in v3.3.5 (last stable) bootstrap.min.css was at ~123kb. The new 4.0.0 alpha bootstrap.min.css is at ~88kb. WOW. That's just amazing. Congrats to everyone who worked on this project. I'm always so impressed with the work done on it! Also, I want to add, I don't care where you land on the side of the debate whether to use Bootstrap or not, there is some very smart minds behind the pro…

>>> I don't care where you land on the side of the debate whether to use Bootstrap or not. I used to be totally against Bootstrap for a myriad of reasons. Then I got hired to build a fairly complex transactional application for a large health care organization under a tight schedule. Bootstrap allowed me to get a UI up and running super fast with all the components I needed, out of the box. It literally saved me hund…

I never got the hate for Boostrap or other frameworks. They definitely save a lot of time, and you don't necessarily end up looking like every other site if you put in some effort[1].

[1]http://expo.getbootstrap.com/

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#92

Post by ckluis »

JohnBooty wrote: post #74
ckluis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do I live in some sort of parrallel universe that thinks a well documented base design for dashboard/app that will presumably continue to mature for $99 is SUPER STINKING CHEAP? If this is officially supported by the Bootstrap project - this to me feels like a nuts deal.

I agree. I have definitely wasted $99 worth of time struggling with some of the crap commercial $5/$10/$15 Bootstrap themes out there.

It feels like something officially supported would solve much of the poorly-documented semi-custom - virtually untweakable themes you can buy for $5.

This feels (even in alpha) like a HUGE move in the right direction.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#93

Post by xrstf »

pyre wrote: post #38
o_____________o wrote: post #9

They seem pretty confident about Sass; It seems outdated and clunky to me, in part because it's always going to be the only Ruby dependency in any of my projects. The Javascript parser never found parity from what I know. By contrast, PostCSS is faster and has massive adoption. Seems like the way forward. Anybody think this is wrong? > PostCSS can do the same work as preprocessors like Sass, Less, and Stylus. But Pos…

> in part because it's always going to be the only Ruby dependency in any of my projects. The Javascript parser never found parity from what I know. Now that libsass (C or C++ implementation) has matured, the Ruby dependency is not necessary. I always resented Sass (vs. Less) a bit because of the Ruby dependency (in projects not using Ruby otherwise). Now that you can link against libsass, I don't feel like that's an…

Yeah I really love how I now not only need Node and npm, but also gcc to install/build a frickin' web project. Because f*ck the platform-independence we got with Node, who cares if a simple `npm install` takes 30 minutes to complete.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#94

Post by coldtea »

MichaelGG wrote: post #66
ckluis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do I live in some sort of parrallel universe that thinks a well documented base design for dashboard/app that will presumably continue to mature for $99 is SUPER STINKING CHEAP? If this is officially supported by the Bootstrap project - this to me feels like a nuts deal.

You live in a superposition. It is very cheap! Yet when people are selling the same thing for $4, it also looks like a lot, even though it isn't. I recently bought some themes and I had to make a conscious effort to simply ignore the price. In fact, I wish such sites had an option to hide all pricing info. (Same in mobile apps. $5 is a steal for a decent app/game, by any direct measure of value. But comparatively, $5…

>Yet when people are selling the same thing for $4, it also looks like a lot, even though it isn't.

Here's your problem: you assume it's "the same thing". Just because the $4 thing looks OK doesn't mean it has the same code quality underneath, or that it wasn't stolen (as lots of "premium themes" are).

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#95

Post by Kiro »

> Pixels have been swapped for rems and ems where appropriate to make responsive typography and component sizing even easier.

Can someone explain the benefit of this?

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#96

Post by coldtea »

mbreedlove wrote: post #16
o_____________o wrote: post #9

They seem pretty confident about Sass; It seems outdated and clunky to me, in part because it's always going to be the only Ruby dependency in any of my projects. The Javascript parser never found parity from what I know. By contrast, PostCSS is faster and has massive adoption. Seems like the way forward. Anybody think this is wrong? > PostCSS can do the same work as preprocessors like Sass, Less, and Stylus. But Pos…

They mentioned they're using libsass, a C/C++ port of the compiler. Although it's only an issue if you're using the source and not the compiled CSS. The same issue exists with v3 needing a LESS compiler.

>The same issue exists with v3 needing a LESS compiler.

Only there are TONS of LESS compilers, even a straight PHP one, a pure JS etc, whereas Sass has either Ruby or a C/C++ dependency.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#97

Post by coldtea »

Kiro wrote: post #95

> Pixels have been swapped for rems and ems where appropriate to make responsive typography and component sizing even easier. Can someone explain the benefit of this?

You can resize a top-level font size value (namely, the "html" node, e.g. to make it smaller for a mobile screen) and the rem-based fonts sizes for all your components change respectively.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#98

Post by yazaddaruvala »

jasoncartwright wrote: post #35
pbreit wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, $99.

$99 to have your site look like hundreds of others? No thanks.

You're correct that this is foolish for any entity who's primary differentiator is their website.

If you're Seemless, competing with 10 other companies that do identical things, you probably don't want to also look exactly like them. If you're Cloudflare, Heroku, Twitter, Mint, Chase (or even Google), as long as its not hindering improvements to functionality or ergonomics (which it might - but also might not), who cares?

Meanwhile, primarily this is appropriate for small players. If you're in the early stages of building anything, you want to build your core product but have your website still look professional. The correct sentiment here might be: "$99 to have your site look as professional as all the others! Yes please."

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#99

Post by Kiro »

coldtea wrote: post #97
Kiro wrote: post #95

> Pixels have been swapped for rems and ems where appropriate to make responsive typography and component sizing even easier. Can someone explain the benefit of this?

You can resize a top-level font size value (namely, the "html" node, e.g. to make it smaller for a mobile screen) and the rem-based fonts sizes for all your components change respectively.

Thanks. What about em?

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#100

Post by thomasrossi »

mdo wrote: post #27
bluetidepro wrote: post #22

One amazing thing to note is that in v3.3.5 (last stable) bootstrap.min.css was at ~123kb. The new 4.0.0 alpha bootstrap.min.css is at ~88kb. WOW. That's just amazing. Congrats to everyone who worked on this project. I'm always so impressed with the work done on it! Also, I want to add, I don't care where you land on the side of the debate whether to use Bootstrap or not, there is some very smart minds behind the pro…

Thanks for noticing! :) I spent a lot of time deleting stuff lol. Still more to optimize around though as we work through the alphas.

Thanks for the work! I would have no clue on UI without bootstrap
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