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Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

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Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#891

Post by lmm »

teakettle42 wrote: post #540
Jedd wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> PS: I am strong supporter of Gun rights and proud gun owner. I don't understand the pride bit. It seems like a regrettable situation where your distrust of your fellow citizens is so strong that you are comforted by the ability to kill them with minimal effort. (I'm in Australia, where we have some truly horrendous legislation, but I totally agree with our gun ownership laws here, and echo other people's observatio…

> I don't understand the pride bit. I can't speak to the parent, but I take pride in self-reliance, and taking responsibility for securing and defending the well-being of myself, my family, neighbors, and community. I also am a volunteer, state-certified structure firefighter, and take pride in that for the exact same reason. You might find it interesting that, as part of our classroom instruction, my structure firef…

Inherent? Like, sure, I'm dimly aware that there are guns somewhere, and that if things get really bad then the police ultimately call in the firearm squad occasionally, but it doesn't feel like something that's inherently necessary.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#892

Post by Glyptodon »

belorn wrote: post #631
nradov wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In most US counties animal control responds late or not at all. Obviously you can't seriously expect farmers to just wait around while feral dogs kill their livestock.

The cost of gun education in public education would be pretty higher than simply increasing funding to animal control in order to improve response times.

The rural US is very spread out and large, and often slow to travel over washed out dirt roads or worse. If you wanted 5 or 10 minute response time across the continental US you'd have to hire and equip 3 or 4 people per every 5 or 10 miles across the whole US, people who'd 95%+ of their time doing nothing.

I can't see how there's any way gun education in public high schools or similar wouldn't be drastically cheaper. Not that I think they're options that should be viewed as policy substitutes or alternatives.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#893

Post by Dma54rhs »

cratermoon wrote: post #852
Dma54rhs wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taliban never had the backing of Russia, what is this bs you're spreading?

https://apnews.com/article/europe-russia-taliban-f25c1a8b030...

You just shared a article saying the had contacts with them. South Korea has a contact with North as well, that is how countries operate.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#894

Post by Glyptodon »

kelnos wrote: post #774
Glyptodon wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To begin with you're creating a premise that the only reason gun legality can be justified is self defense, particularly against other people. I do not accept this premise. There are many other premises for gun legality. That said, when I was very young my grandfather had to shoot a number of stray dogs out his car window while driving through a rough pasture because they'd killed a couple calves and were attacking h…

> you're creating a premise that the only reason gun legality can be justified is self defense What other premise is there, when we're talking about a device that is designed to seriously injure and kill others? It's either a defensive weapon, or, worse, an offensive one. I think hunting is a totally legitimate use for a gun. I think your grandfather's case is as well, though there certainly are other solutions to hi…

I mean "the thing that gets you the most" is pretty much true for literally almost anything. You can go to a store and pick up an TIG welder or a chainsaw, or all kinds of other things no problem, no question, that arguably require much more in the way of practice and training than a firearm.

That said, I don't really get what you think licenses and such accomplish. A gun is 19th century tech that you make in a garage. Anybody who really wants one can make one, all the registration and licensing is mostly a burden on people who are mostly harmless. And it's very post-facto/pre-cog-ish.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#895

Post by ApolloFortyNine »

comrh wrote: post #237
chmod600 wrote: post #73

There's something admirable about the idea that a government would not take away all the guns. The idea that people should not have to give up all of their ability to fight. The idea that people should not be entirely dependent on police for their defense. And the idea that physically weaker people (often women) can defend themselves against the strong. Does this idea work? Surprisingly well. If you had to guess the…

Murder rate isn't the whole story. Check out the suicide rate, how gun ownership affects a successful attempt and who is killing themselves in the US.

This argument has to be the worst out of all the anti gun arguments.

We going to ban rope next? Ban trains, since it's a bit too easy to step in front of one? Knives?

If someone wants to kill their self, there are innumerable easy ways to do so. It's even likely in most households you could hang yourself quicker than you could get to your gun, if that's really what you wanted.

Giving up the right to own a gun so that someone who wants to commit suicide is forced to use another means is such a terrible argument.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#896

Post by ApolloFortyNine »

kelnos wrote: post #159
seneca wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with most of your post. One small quibble though: > There's something admirable about the idea that a government would not take away all the guns. The whole point is that the government Can Not take away guns, not that they "would not". Inalienable rights preceed government, they are not granted by it. In fact, the government is supposed to exist to safe guard them. I think that's an important philosophical p…

> Inalienable rights preceed government, they are not granted by it. That's a nice ideal, but in reality governments can do and take away whatever they want, and a guarantee that they won't take away your "inalienable" rights is only as good as the system built around that government, and the willingness of its people to fight (physically or legally) for their rights.

The right to freedom of speech in the US is almost truly uninhibited. Even the "you can't yell fire in a crowded theater" argument was actually revisited by the Supreme Court and thrown out.

If there's an amendment to the constitution to ban owning a firearm, so be it. But if that right is severely limited without an amendment, it would be natural to fear for the rest. The verbiage on the first 10 amendments is incredibly simple. "shall not be infringed".

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#897

Post by nasredin »

adamredwoods wrote: post #559
enchiridion wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With regard to your gun control points, there is a bit of nuance you missed that people (like me, if I wasn’t trying to help you steelman your argument) will criticize. Specifically, there are already heavy restrictions on automatic weapons, which are basically never used in criminal acts. Every automatically gun in the US has to be registered with the federal government for $200 and a lot of paperwork. In effect it…

SKS rifles cost over US$600, a $200 licensing fee isn't infringing any rights compared to the right to a fair and speedy trial. The term 'assault rifle' is used loosely by us, but in terms of law there are definitions: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/1296...

Correction.

SKS is semi-automatic.

So don't need the $200 ATF machine gun stamp.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#898

Post by mpweiher »

GiorgioG wrote: post #131
sofixa wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the U.S. murder rate is not all that remarkable, really The US is at 4.96/100,000 for 2012. For reference, Angola is better at 4.85. Bulgaria and Romania, the poorest countries in the EU, are at 1.3. France is at 1.2. If by not remarkable you mean 3 as bad as other developed countries, sure. The numbers are only for intentional homicide, not even counting accidents and suicides which are also made worse by the…

The murder rate varies widely by state/area. Chicago's murder rate is significantly higher than its suburbs. The murder rate in the town (37k residents) I live in (in the south) is effectively zero. I wouldn't doubt that all of my neighbors around me (most of us are originally from a northern state) have guns and we've managed not to kill each other. Do you think the French revolution didn't require violence?

> The murder rate varies widely by state/area.

The same is true in other countries. Berlin has a murder rate vastly higher than the countryside, and let's not mention Frankfurt. However even the crime cesspool that is Berlin has a murder rate comparable to or lower than the "low crime" areas in the US.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#899

Post by 01100011 »

alienthrowaway wrote: post #521
Fogest wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have watched a lot of videos from Peter Santenello [1] on YouTube. He takes a somewhat deep dive into a lot of communities that the traditional media typically fails to highlight or fails to do it properly. He has quite a few videos where he speaks with people in the "hood" or the "projects" in various places across America. In many of these videos he asks some of the people in these communities what they think abo…

> These communities never seem to actually say they want less policing in them. They do! They've been saying it a long time, but no one paid them any attention until George Floyd's life was slowly and casually extinguished by a police officer on camera. Go ask any black male from New York in their 20s or 30s what they think about "Stop and frisk" and the sense of being violated by over policing. Before you accuse me…

I'm not sure 'stop and frisk' == 'policing in general'.

Sure, the actual situation matters. People will probably choose no cops over racist cops. I am not cynical enough yet to think that is the only choice available though.

OP is talking about policing in general, and I've seen other news reports(not youtube, but that doesn't make it gospel) that align with what he's saying. I'm not trying to say your opinion or experiences are wrong, but I think there is more nuance to this discussion and absolutist positions aren't very useful or accurate.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#900

Post by mpweiher »

truffdog wrote: post #377
sofixa wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the U.S. murder rate is not all that remarkable, really The US is at 4.96/100,000 for 2012. For reference, Angola is better at 4.85. Bulgaria and Romania, the poorest countries in the EU, are at 1.3. France is at 1.2. If by not remarkable you mean 3 as bad as other developed countries, sure. The numbers are only for intentional homicide, not even counting accidents and suicides which are also made worse by the…

The US murder rate isn't normally distributed. It's highly concentrated in a few hotspots, with most of the country living in areas with European murder rates. The news is national though, so you wind up in this weird situation with suburbanites buying guns and worried about urban Chicago a thousand miles away.

> The US murder rate isn't normally distributed

Neither are the murder rates in other countries.

> It's highly concentrated in a few hotspots

Same here.

> with most of the country living in areas with European murder rates.

Nope. You need to compare the non-hotspot areas of the US with the non-hotspot areas of Europe. And you'll see the same difference as before.

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