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Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

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Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#891

Post by facepalm »

socksy wrote: post #871
facepalm wrote: post #821

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then don't write "I guess it is common", state the number of women who told you such things. Personally I haven't heard many such stories from women in tech. Also differentiate between some colleague being interested in them and boss proposing sex on first day.

Have you tried asking them? It feels vaguely ridiculous to expect hard data and facts on things of "people told me". I know I have female friends who have told me similar stories, but I couldn't for the life of me remember how many, nor would I want to start iterating these anecdotes to a stranger on the internet. In exactly the same way it would be to start statistically analysing any other statement on "people told…

I took issue with the "I guess it is very common that women expect that kind of harassment", because it plays into sexist stereotypes. I think in these matters )(sexism, racism, bias), it pays to be precise. How else can you counter bias? What if countless people told me they had been mugged by black people?

Don't understand your comment about lines in the sand. What do you mean?

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#893

Post by Throwadev »

sokoloff wrote: post #71
u_wot_m8 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like the think that eventually karma will catch up with Uber. Hard to think of a single positive thing to say about the company.

Here's my positive thing. Taking a cab to the airport from my house in Cambridge, MA runs about $42 before tip, so call it $48 or so. An UberX costs $24.30 right now and UberPool costs $14.30 right now. Additionally, I can summon the ride more easily and get better feedback about the arrival time, giving me more confidence/less anxiety that I'll have a problem getting to the airport on time. As a consumer, by reducin…

Are there any Uber competitors in your city?

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#894

Post by tyingq »

Apocryphon wrote: post #478
home_boi wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm of the opinion that the average software engineer in the USA is already overpaid and underworked with excellent benefits and low incentive to unionize. I'm simplifying it a bit but if you don't like your job, just grab a copy of Cracking the Coding Interview and apply to big companies. The big companies pay very well, have good benefits and interview everyone because of the need for a high head count

Doctors, lawyers, professional athletes, and leading Hollywood actors and actresses might all be overpaid relative to other professions, and yet they all have professional organizations, even unions, representing them. What makes software engineers so exceptional?

Pilots too.

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#895

Post by rimantas »

limelight wrote: post #395
calcsam wrote: post #15

In case anyone isn't sure why the original interaction is harassment: relationships within a reporting chain are generally prohibited, for both legal, ethical, and practical reasons. Sex becoming part of the effective job description crosses both legal and ethical lines, and team effectiveness is hindered when people wonder whether someone is getting special treatment because they're sleeping with the boss. A manager…

I don't understand how anyone could be unsure about that being harassment. It's about as clear-cut as you can get. He should have been fired the day that surfaced. If someone who worked for me ever did something like that, they'd be out the door pronto. It speaks volumes that he wasn't, to the point which I am irrationally tempted to doubt the veracity of her claims. Don't proposition anyone in your reporting chain.…

  > do the adult thing and ignore it.
While it probably the best advice it does sound a bit like pope's advice for the gay people: it is ok, if you do not act on it. Being unhappy is just an adult thing, I guess.

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#896

Post by nilved »

KerrickStaley wrote: post #713

I work at Lyft, and although I'm in different shoes (SW male), I really can't see this happening and HR/management stonewalling the complaints. We don't tolerate harassment, and we stand up for each other. I know I try to. [1] I honestly don't understand how Uber attracts talent. Lyft and Uber both work on really interesting problems. [2] The difference is that Uber are, well, the sort of people Travis Kalanick would…

A thread about workplace sexual harassment is hardly an appropriate place to plug your company.

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#897

Post by smcl »

MrAwesomeSauce wrote: post #867

This is the third most popular story in Hacker News of all time [1], and I couldn't be happier. This can't have been easy to write but the more posts like this, the more likely people who suffer the same issues at their workplace will share their experiences. [1] https://hn.algolia.com/?query=&sort=byPopularity&prefix&page...

Yet in under a day it's off the front page despite >900 comments and >3700 points. The post was interesting and shocking ... and I have (anecdotal) memories of less-popular stories sticking around far longer. Weird

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#898

Post by rleigh »

facepalm wrote: post #819
kevinburke wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would guess that this happens more often than you imagine. Women often don't share stories like this for fear of retribution at their current company or future companies, or because they think you won't believe them. In addition NDA's are often a condition of receiving severance. Most women in Silicon Valley have had experiences similar to those mentioned in the article (HR disbelief, multiple women reporting same…

Your guessing sounds rather sexist. Why not stick to data instead of guessing? There is enough bias against men already.

It would be nice to believe that all these reported events are exceptional, and to an extent they are atypical, but it is indicative of a fairly broken work culture that such things happen.

Until recently, I'd only ever read accounts of bad things like this happening at certain conferences, and not seen anything first hand. A few months back, one of the female staff on our team changed their github picture. When mentioning this in conversation, it turned out that random people (not physically at work, but github users who did not know any of us in person) were harassing/propositioning her solely due to that image. What sort of screwed up person does that?! People should be able to do their jobs without dealing with crap like that.

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#899

Post by rleigh »

toothbrush wrote: post #465
PaulRobinson wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have a "whiskey club", and regularly go to the pub where I work. We don't do it at lunchtime. We don't do it during the working day. 5:30pm on a Friday? Let's have a glass of whiskey together. Somebody joining/leaving, or we haven't been out together for a while? Let's go to the pub after work one evening. There is a #drinks channel in Slack where people who fancy a drink after work co-ordinate, and several of wil…

> As for team dynamics, it means we know each other better and bond more frequently. Not a problem, I think. Except for the non-drinkers in your team. I suspect that they either a) feel left out, because a non-drinker at a pub has a boring time, and has to keep justifying their empty glass b) probably miss out on important decisions if a majority of the important people in a team are present, which is bad dynamics c)…

Whatever you choose to do, some subset of the team will end up being left out. Some of my team occasionally go out for a drink+meal. Usually when some remote workers are in town for the day, and we go out after work. Yes, it excludes people with families/other commitments. But lots of other activities would exclude exactly the same people; you can't force the whole team to be sociable after work hours.

We do these things:

1) We don't make any decisions when team members are missing; they have to be done during work hours when everyone is able to participate 2) There's no obligation to drink (why would there be?); several of the team don't drink, and there is no pressure to do so, they get soft drinks/tea/coffee/whatever they like

As someone who is very shy and introverted, it's one of the few times I actually go out socially, and it's a time to unwind and have a chat with your coworkers and associated friends/partners/family. I don't think doing this has any negative impact upon the rest of the team, so long as you don't do any serious discussion and decision making which excludes others.

Re: Reflecting on one very, very strange year at Uber

#900

Post by kenferry »

bsaul wrote: post #173
exolymph wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you be okay with it if you started a new job and your boss instantly propositioned you?

Of course not, but i'll just tell her / him i'm not interested, and see if the person's keep insisting and make my life at work miserable, or if he's just a desperate person having a very bad day... There are many reason why someone would be a pain to work with honestly. I could imagine someone insisting on people going to drink after work being a pita for a muslim for example, or a guy talking all the time about pol…

Consider, would you not feel pressure, from your new boss at your new company, that maybe your turning them down might have negative repercussions for your career? Would it not give you great anxiety?

There's a power relationship between reports. Most companies have explicit guidelines that prohibit romantic relationships along the management chain.

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