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Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

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Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#891

Post by Chris2048 »

colemickens wrote: post #390
gohrt wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump said that illegal immigrants are "rapists and murderers and some good people", "not their best people". You can disagree strongly with Trump's claims about what motivates illegal immigration, but Trump's stated view is not racist: he discriminated between two groups within a single race, and did not distinguish between races.

This is some amazing mental gymnastics here, wew. ""White people are racist, ignorant assholes, except for some of them."" ^^ I'm sure this comment will do well!

Fair enough, still more lenient than the average leftist view that omits the "except for some of them".

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#892

Post by Chris2048 »

skoopie wrote: post #456
betolink wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"They(Mexicans) are rapists and murderers" Take a look[1] you may have been stranded on an Island the last 2 years and perhaps you did not hear what Trump have said. Now, not all Trump supporters are racists (maybe Thiel isn't? who knows!), but all of them are telling us implicitly that racism and bigotry are not deal breakers. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37zvOZ17eSE

Can you tell me which specific Mexicans he was talking about?

Specifically the rapists.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#893

Post by prairiedogg »

rubberstamp wrote: post #750
prairiedogg wrote: post #617

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi masondixon! > But look at the last 15 years of foreign policy from "statesmen". We had two wars, Obama missed seeing the rise of ISIS, Syria is a humanitarian nightmare, we had a huge financial crash, and terrorism is on the rise. So is your argument that "statesmen" have failed to avoid crisis, therefore someone who is not a "statesman" will be able to better avoid crisis? Would it be fair then to say that becaus…

Hi prairiedogg, Well this thread is basically nitpicking each other. Let me tell you one thing. If you are a citizen of USA, you could run for president and be one as long as you are win a majority in a majority of states. Now, if you are interested in politics you, like me, would be following political decisions from a variety of sources and try to analyze it(see if its truth and try to understand if its fair to the…

Hi rubberstamp!

I disagree that this thread is "just nitpicking each other" - I think it's been both educational and civil. For instance, when masondixon learned that Reagan had a political career before his presidency, masondixon thanked dbmikus for pointing it out. It's hard to find that level of candor on an internet discussion board - and masondixon seemed to want a genuine dialog that was free of the ad-hominem attacks that he or she had apparently been experiencing on other sites.

In regards to your "argument", I don't find it convincing:

> My argument is you are as good as any statesman so long as you have a working brain.

I disagree. My brain works reasonably well, but I don't consider myself fit to fill the office of the presidency - for a wide variety of reasons. I have no understanding of large portions of the world or even of the United States itself. I don't know how economics works on a macro scale. Just as I would never hire a person whose brain worked well, but had never written a line of code to fill the most important engineering role in my company, I would never say that just because my brain worked well, that I would be a good statesman or a good choice for president of the United States.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#894

Post by Chris2048 »

carapace wrote: post #782
_qbjt wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, bigotry is defined as "intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself". I'm not defending Trump but it's fairly obvious to any non-partisan that the left wing is just as guilty of this.

Look, it's not rocket science: Tolerant of | Tolerance | Yes Intolerant of | Tolerance | No Tolerant of | Intolerance | No Intolerant of | Intolerance | Yes It's a little nicer as a 2x2 table, but whatever.

"hold different opinions from oneself" is subjectively tolerance/intolerance. This table exploits word games, because the first column is "in/tolerant to hearing the opions of", and the second is "holds opinions I believe to be exclusive to a special sub-community of society".

You cannot correctly come to a decision about the latter, without listening, which requires the former.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#895

Post by Chris2048 »

yolesaber wrote: post #372
_qbjt wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, bigotry is defined as "intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself". I'm not defending Trump but it's fairly obvious to any non-partisan that the left wing is just as guilty of this.

So by your line of reasoning, we should feel bad because we don't tolerate neo-Nazis?

Difference between "necessary" and "sufficient".

"hold(s) different opinions from oneself" isn't the only characteristic of Nazis, they have other attributes which do justify not tolerating them.

But yes, if it wasn't those attributes, you could still "tolerate" them, in the sense of allowing their opinions to be heard. You don't have to agree. You can even explicitly argue with them.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#896

Post by Chris2048 »

throw2016 wrote: post #732
betolink wrote: post #240

People here giving Thiel a free pass on his views and support for bigotry is just disgusting.

HN being full of sociopaths is well known. Being apologists for Thiel's odiousness is a new low. The man clearly states what he means, trying to 'clarify what he exactly means' is convuluted apologism and revisonism. This is like saying slave trade is wrong but you support it. Ok. If you agree with his views defend them on the platform of reason. Let's not get carried away here. Trump has not won because he is racist…

> HN being full of sociopaths is well known

citation needed.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#897

Post by mrgordon »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #890
mrgordon wrote: post #841

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never said this only happens on the right (whether I think it occurs more on the right is a separate argument but not one that I made here). But the post I responded to was saying they voted for Trump (despite his repeated racism, sexism, and bullying) because the poster perceives the left as bullying. My point is simply that Trump and friends are serious bullies so this isn't a credible reason for choosing him ove…

I think masondixon's point was bullying by the left , not by Clinton . Trump is in fact a bully, and at least some of his friends seem to be too, but that doesn't actually address masondixon's point. And in fact I think masondixon is right. The left, taken as a whole, is more bullying to most people than the right is. You can argue that, if you're LGBTQ, say, the right is more bullying. If you're just a middle class…

I strongly disagree.

First of all, more than half the population is female (not to even look at race, sexual orientation, those who don't identify as male or female, etc.) so the majority of people by far are not white males who have "no personal stake in the culture wars." I see every day how people use male pronouns when talking about engineers, implying time and time again that women aren't engineers or that it would be very atypical for them to be. This pushes women out of STEM fields slowly but surely over time, both because they feel they don't belong and because their superiors actually assume males will be better subconsciously due to stereotypes and language norms. You can literally put a man's name on a woman's resume and it is more likely to be accepted.

Secondly, the truth is that in most of America you are still much more likely to be harassed for being female, non-heterosexual, non-caucasian, etc. than for using the wrong pronoun. Its not like every time someone says "he" without knowing the person's gender they get called out on it. I appreciate that the original poster felt strongly about one particular case where it put someone's job at risk, but race, gender, and sexual preference put millions of jobs at risk daily.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#898

Post by Chris2048 »

couchand wrote: post #380
pjscott wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His Reddit AMA has some interesting comments on that. https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2g4g95/peter_thiel_te... He was asked "Why do you financially support so many anti-gay GOP politicians?" Which is exactly what you're wondering about. And lo, he answered: "If I thought they were anti-gay, then I would not support them. I do not find myself fully on the side of any of our political leaders -- because none of…

To describe Trump as simply warty is to vastly misrepresent or dismiss his proud racism and misogyny.

> his proud racism and misogyny

The amount of mis-quotation around Trumps alleged "racism and misogyny" means I'd like at least a few specifics along with any such claim, just to be clear what your level is.

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#899

Post by Chris2048 »

ForrestN wrote: post #150
woofyman wrote: post #95

I don't understand how a gay man can support a political party who's platform wants to reverse marriage equality.

As a fellow gay man I can tell you Thiel clearly appears to be quite conflicted about his homosexuality, which is why he victimized Gawker so gratuitously for revealing it to the public. Unfortunately, because becoming a billionaire is often random, sometimes people with mental illness and deep emotional pain can rise to incredible power.

> which is why he victimized Gawker so gratuitously

Funny to describe his suit as "victimized"

> sometimes people with mental illness and deep emotional pain can rise to incredible power

Are you talking about Thiel? Care to justify this slander?

Re: Peter Thiel To Join Trump Transition Team

#900

Post by floodyberry- »

masondixon wrote: post #661
floodyberry- wrote: post #637

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you were worried that the repercussions for saying whatever you like may be too high, and in exchange you were willing to potentially sacrifice women's rights, minorities rights, lgbt+ rights, the environment, business regulations, and whatever else conservative Trump appointments might do? If only the third-wave feminist bloggers, social justice warriors, black lives matters activists, etc, had kept their mouths…

> you were willing to potentially sacrifice women's rights, minorities rights, lgbt+ rights, the environment, business regulations, and whatever else conservative Trump appointments might do? You see how here you are saying that I am in favour of sacrificing womens, minorities, lgbt, etc. rights. You see how it is basically saying: You are are a sexist, misogynist, racist? Why don't you ask me what I think about thos…

> Why don't you ask me what I think about those issues?

You didn't vote for your views, you voted for Trump. You had to believe that whatever would result from a Trump election was at least balanced by your desire to show the left the consequences of their free speech, yes?

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