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Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

telegraph.co.uk

881–890 of 1001 posts

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#881

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can raise you personal "taxes" and provide for you father if you so desire.

That’s not even close to the same thing, and you know it.

It's the same if you sum it up across the population: all the benefits that elderly consume without producing are subtracted from what young people produce without consuming.

If you want your parents to retire earlier than the population-averaged system can allow, you're free to do it a non-averaged way.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#882
post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those who downvote you should find statistics from Denmark which migration sources are net positive and which ain’t.

No, you're reversing the burden of proof. People who make bold claims need to back them up somehow. If they fail to do so, their posts have no information value and should be downvoted.

Those who think migrants are positive should bring proof too.

Or is it just trying to claim moral high ground by cherry picking?

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#883
post #765

Realistically, what are countries supposed to do? Almost every single industrialized country has a birth rate below replacement, so there's fewer younger people to help carry the burdens. Medical care means the elderly live on and on and on, draining enormous costs as they age. I'm not trying to be cruel, but from a pure numbers sense it makes perfect sense. Would you prefer taxes go up instead? Lessen spending on in…

Tax wealth. I know that's a very hard thing to do due to the mobility and political power of capital, but we need international co-operation and just do it. That's where all the money is and where it's going at an accelerating rate.

Wealth = power

With power, comes the ability to change systems so those with wealth/power do not lose it.

There are exceptions, but that is the rule.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#884

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would you fix it? Note that even Scandinavian nations with very generous healthcare and childcare policies can't raise their rates, it simply seems that as people get wealthier, they have fewer kids, regardless of the status of their country's systems.

My take is that saying the problem is birth rates is misguided. Surely we have enough labor to provide for the elderly, why can’t our economy be structured to get this labor to the people who need it?

We don’t. That really is the answer. Look at unemployment rates. They basically can’t go much lower.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#885

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is nothing sad about this. Mandatory pensions are not a vacation sponsored by the government but a way to provide for those who can't provide for themselves. If you were born in the 70s, you should have known for most of your adult life that your normal retirement age is likely going to be around 70. The demographic situation is not new, the solutions have been discussed extensively since at least the 90s, and…

Part of the deal with progress should be that we all start working less. If not is the progress all that attractive? Improved health so we can all work more is kinda stupid.

We are working less than ever, living longer in retirement, AND spending more of early life in education and training rather than working.

Denmark in particular is seeing some great decreases in annual working hours for working people. https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/annual-working-hours-per-...

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#886

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is nothing sad about this. Mandatory pensions are not a vacation sponsored by the government but a way to provide for those who can't provide for themselves. If you were born in the 70s, you should have known for most of your adult life that your normal retirement age is likely going to be around 70. The demographic situation is not new, the solutions have been discussed extensively since at least the 90s, and…

Part of the deal with progress should be that we all start working less. If not is the progress all that attractive? Improved health so we can all work more is kinda stupid.

I’m not sure I understand your point. You’re disappointed by progress? Get in line.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#887

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Part of the deal with progress should be that we all start working less. If not is the progress all that attractive? But we don't want to work less, we want more stuff.

My friends and I would love to have 4/5 or 3/5 of working days with 4/5 or 3/5 of salary, but sadly I don't know any companies that offer that. I understand that it may be hard with meeting culture, but we can make 1 or 2 days with no meetings. I don't want to go back to the stress and uncertainty of freelancing; I want a predictable, safe income with simply scaled-back hours/pay. My salary (and my friends') in IT is…

In Germany companies are legally required to allow part-time deals for previously full-time employees. (§ 8+9 TzBfG (Teilzeit- und Befristungsgesetz)

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#888
post #57
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you really claiming there is some big health issue in the nordic countries suppressing life span?

No. I am suggesting that governments invest more into ensuring their aging population is healthy instead of draining every bit of life from them by making them work later and later.

no one is being drained doing nordic office work in their 70s.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#889
post #853

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think if you've put in 40-45 years for the man, you should be allowed to have some good 10 years for yourself. Travel, play golf, cross a continent in a camper or climb a mountain. Not unless you've raised 2 more workers to pick up the shovel while you're playing golf. You could, of course, rely on your neighbor's kids through taxes and pensions but when your neighbor thinks the same it becomes problematic. On th…

But if you don't have kids, it's easier to save money to fund your own retirement. Kids are expensive.

The point just flew over your head.

Yes, you could do this, but it's parasitic behavior that depends on your ability to extract value from the labor of other people's kids. If everyone does this, then there are no kids to take over the work to keep things running and money doesn't do anything anymore because the economy stops working.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#890
post #765

Realistically, what are countries supposed to do? Almost every single industrialized country has a birth rate below replacement, so there's fewer younger people to help carry the burdens. Medical care means the elderly live on and on and on, draining enormous costs as they age. I'm not trying to be cruel, but from a pure numbers sense it makes perfect sense. Would you prefer taxes go up instead? Lessen spending on in…

Tax wealth. I know that's a very hard thing to do due to the mobility and political power of capital, but we need international co-operation and just do it. That's where all the money is and where it's going at an accelerating rate.

    > Tax wealth
Are you saying that Denmark, a nordic socialist country, has not taxed wealth enough?
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