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U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

washingtonpost.com

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Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#881

Post by alt227 »

echelon_musk wrote: post #319
EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My gf doesn't have iCloud. She makes a backup from time to time by connecting her iphone to her macbook, encrypts the backup folder with 7z, and then I store the resulting file in my dropbox. I follow the same procedure with my Android phone, no google cloud. BTW anything I upload to Dropbox is encrypted first.

In case you don't already know, if you don't encrypt an iPhone backup with macOS first the backup won't contain _all_ of your data. Apple says "Encrypted backups can include information that unencrypted backups don't" however the list they give is non-exhaustive. You might find yourself disappointed when trying to restore a non-encrypted backup that you've encrypted yourself in a disaster scenario.

Surely you can just open the archive and check whats in the backup yourself to satisfy that?

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#882

Post by alt227 »

brink wrote: post #476
ARandomerDude wrote: post #337

In 10 years we'll all be shocked to discover this headline should have read "US Tells UK to Demand Apple Create Global iCloud Encryption Backdoor".

Why would you suspect that the US pushed their hand on this? This is not out of character at all for the UK.

Thats what Five Eyes does and always has done. It asks other countries for info on their own citizens so that they do not have to break their own laws in accessing their data directly.

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#883

Post by MobiusHorizons »

reverendsteveii wrote: post #534
aunty_helen wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you using Russia and China as examples of the bad guys here. They're not asking for global access to everyones data, the UK is. The UK are the bad guys.

I read it as using Russia and China as the other guys, rather than the bad guys. The idea is to eliminate any pre-existing feelings of trust and illustrate the fact that once your data is held by anyone in the global intelligence community you should think of it as being held by everyone in the global intelligence community.

Whatever you think of their politics, they are authoritarian in structure. There are fewer restrictions on what those governments can do with the information. I’m not saying anyone should trust the UK government here, but it’s easier to see the risks in a country that doesn’t have to be accountable to the people or the legal system.

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#884

Post by celdon25 »

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #849
celdon25 wrote: post #721

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Erm, a nationwide injunction was already made against that part of the executive order by a federal judge. You're the second person today I've seen try to imply that we're in a dictatorship because of that executive order. Whoever is spreading that misinformation should be fact-checked!

The president has ordered the bureaucracy to ignore the 14th Amendment. You may be blasé about that, and even consider pointing that out to be "misinformation," but I'm not. It's a sign that Constitutional rule in the US is in serious danger. I'm not even going to get into all the other unconstitutional actions Trump has taken, such as appointing Elon Musk to lead the most powerful agency in the federal government wi…

> appointing Elon Musk to lead the most powerful agency in the federal government without Senate advice and consent.

You mean this senate? Many of them are not happy with the national debt and are willing to take risks if it gets fixed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BA3ma1MeSIU

Senate consent is only required for actual agency posts. Elon's team is just a small part of the USDS which is part of the Office of the White House. Which doesn't require Senate consent. Elon also has a Top Secret clearance and is technically competent to do the job.

Now I'm not defending everything Elon does but I'm saying that I didn't see anything that looked illegal there about the job description and the hiring itself.

Personally, I'd be happy enough if they just gutted just the FDA. There's probably a lot of other agencies doing harm and are overfunded.

Also, was advice and consent from the senate obtained for all these billions of taxpayer dollars being wasted and given to other countries for things that aren't needed?

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#885

Post by marcosdumay »

JW_00000 wrote: post #103
latexr wrote: post #89

> When asked by The Post whether any government had requested a backdoor, Google spokesman Ed Fernandez did not provide a direct answer but suggested none exist: "Google cannot access Android end-to-end encrypted backup data, even with a legal order," he stated. No, that does not suggest none exists, it only says they don’t have access to it. They could have chosen or have been ordered to give the keys to the governm…

But if they could give a key to the government agency, it wouldn't be end-to-end encrypted, right? Or are you thinking they would have a copy of users' keys that they gave out? (Which I guess is technically possible.)

You can not use a DH key exchange, and create the symmetric key by some procedure that is predictable, or encode the symmetric key with the government's public key and send it to them.

It doesn't stop being end-to-end when you add another end. We often do group chats that way.

Or you can create a side-channel and send al the data there. That would stop it from being end-to-end.

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#886

Post by hx8 »

bilekas wrote: post #692
TrueDuality wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as Apple has a business presence in the UK, they are subject to the laws the UK imposes on them even if they're vastly overreaching and impose on other government's citizens. Not supporting cloud services wouldn't be sufficient to avoid the compliance requirement, they would have to formerly stop doing business in the UK. Looking at the market size that might be a decision that Apple is willing to make as it…

I think this is the most solid answer I’ve seen so far that makes any sense. Could they still go through with it , I’m not sure, they want to project some influence but I still feel this is like haggling for half price to get cost. Someone else here said something spot on for me, we’re all focusing on how bat sh*t this is because it’s global without even considering how human privacy obligations are just ignored. Hum…

Imagine weighing the right of privacy of everyone in the world against the right of safety of 0.8% of the world population.

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#887

Post by marcosdumay »

necovek wrote: post #803

Democracies around the world are increasingly looking to surveil and expose private data of their citizens, and introducing laws where simple act of defiance will become criminal. I believe we should increasingly turn to steganography as a way to ensure our privacy (obviously, combined with encryption). Something that provides simple plausible deniability but lots of data to use as a carrying medium should become the…

> Democracies around the world are increasingly looking to surveil and expose private data of their citizens, and introducing laws where simple act of defiance will become criminal.

Yes. Democracies around the world are increasingly stopping being democracies.

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#888

Post by marcosdumay »

scarface_74 wrote: post #458
snapcaster wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what the hypothesis is in your experiment, i agree that all that stuff is really bad

That all it takes is the co-presidents to say that by giving up your freedom we can get rid of those “evil illegal immigrants” and enough people will give up their rights.

Well, your example doesn't even mention common people.

And the only implication that they exist is about them seeing publicity campaigns of senators.

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#889

Post by marcosdumay »

_t9ow wrote: post #155
Havoc wrote: post #113

UK tech laws seem to consistently be the worst of both worlds. Not rights centric like the EU and not business supportive like the US. Just old people making bad laws about stuff they don't understand - or are straight up citizen hostile, sometimes hard to tell which it is.

> Not rights centric like the EU Sadly, the EU is trying very hard and very persistently to pass the Chat Control bill. So far the EU hasn't succeeded, but I would be surprised if EU politicians didn't keep trying until it is finally codified into law.

The EU has one extremely corrupt legislative body, yes. But they are usually not a problem due to them not having any formal power.

Re: U.K. orders Apple to let it spy on users’ encrypted accounts

#890

Post by alt227 »

fdb345 wrote: post #685

I personally pissed all over the NCA with a Pixel 3 and a 6 digit pin + Graphene OS. UK Law Enforcement can suck my dick. Encryption works people. Use it.

The only way to get one over on the NCA is to irretreivably delete the data they want. As long as it exists, they will extort you and your family uitil you give them the keys.
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