Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

881–890 of 1001 posts

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#881

Post by dham »

dreamcompiler wrote: post #366
bastawhiz wrote: post #257

Lots of people are asking how good the self driving has to be before we tolerate it. I got a one month free trial of FSD and turned it off after two weeks. Quite simply: it's dangerous. - It failed with a cryptic system error while driving - It started making a left turn far too early that would have scraped the left side of the car on a sign. I had to manually intervene. - In my opinion, the default setting accelera…

> It didn't merge left to make room for vehicles merging onto the highway. The vehicles then tried to cut in. The system should have avoided an unsafe situation like this in the first place. This is what bugs me about ordinary autopilot. Autopilot doesn't switch lanes, but I like to slow down or speed up as needed to allow merging cars to enter my lane. Autopilot never does that, and I've had some close calls with ir…

Autopilot is just adaptive cruise control with lane keep. Literally every car has this now. I don't see people on Toyota, Honda, or Ford forums complaining that a table-stakes feature of a car doesn't adjust speed or change lanes as a car is merging in. Do you know how insane that sounds. I'm assuming you're in software since you're on Hacker news.

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#882

Post by [deleted] »

rootusrootus wrote: post #518

I'm on my second free FSD trial, just started for me today. Gave it another shot, and it seems largely similar to the last free trial they gave. Fun party trick, surprisingly good, right up until it's not. A hallmark of AI everywhere, is how great it is and just how abruptly and catastrophically it fails occasionally. Please, if you're going to try it, keep both hands on the wheel and your foot ready for the brake. W…

[deleted]

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#883

Post by dham »

eric_cc wrote: post #382
jvanderbot wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have yet to see a difference. I let it highway drive for an hour and it cut off a semi, coming within 9 to 12 inches of the bumper for no reason. I heard about that one believe me. It got stuck in a side street trying to get to a target parking lot, shaking the wheel back and forth. It's no better so far and this is the first day.

Is it possible you have a lemon? Genuine question. I’ve had nothing but positive experiences with FSD for the last several months and many thousands of miles.

A lot of haters mistake safety critical disengagements with "oh the car is doing something I don't like or I wouldn't do"

If you treat the car like it's a student driver or someone else driving, disengagements will go do. If you treat it like you're driving there's also something to complain about.

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#884

Post by dham »

the8472 wrote: post #734
snypher wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So just a few more years of death and injury until they reach a finished product?

We also pay this price with every new human driver we train. again and again.

You won't be able to bring logic to people with Elon derangement syndrome.

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#885

Post by lowbloodsugar »

I'm not turning FSD on until it is a genuine autonomous vehicle that requires no input from me and never disengages. Until Tesla is, under the law, the legal driver of the vehicle, and suffers all the legal impact, you'd have to be mental to let it drive for you. It's like asking, "Hey, here's a chauffeur who has killed several people so far, all over the world. You want him to drive?" Or "Hey, here's a chauffeur. You're fine, you can read a book. But at some point, right when something super dangerous is about to happen, he's going to just panic and stop driving, and then you have to stop whatever you're doing and take over." That's fucking mental.

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#886

Post by llamaimperative »

peutetre wrote: post #880
eschneider wrote: post #761

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You slowly build a relationship with it and understand where it will fail." I spent over a decade working on production computer vision products. You think you can do this, and for some percentage of failures you can. The thing is, there will ALWAYS be some percentage of failure cases where you really can't perceive anything different from a success case. If you want to trust your life to that, fine, but I certainly…

Elon Musk is a technologist. He knows a lot about computers. The last thing Musk would do is trust a computer program: https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/musk-pushes-debunked-... So I guess that's game over for full self-driving.

Oooo maybe he'll get a similar treatment as Fox did versus Dominion.

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#887

Post by stouset »

sokoloff wrote: post #805
deergomoo wrote: post #787

This is an opinion almost certainly based more in emotion than logic, but I don't think I could trust any sort of fully autonomous driving system that didn't involve communication with transmitters along the road itself (like a glideslope and localiser for aircraft approaches) and with other cars on the road. Motorway driving sure, there it's closer to fancy cruise control. But around town, no thank you. I regularly…

> didn't involve communication with transmitters along the road itself (like a glideslope and localiser for aircraft approaches) and with other cars on the road There will be a large number of non-participating vehicles on the road for at least another 50 years. (The average age of a car in the US is a little over 12 years and rising. I doubt we'll see a comms-based standard emerge and be required equipment on new ca…

Hell, ignore vehicles. What about pedestrians, cyclists, animals, construction equipment, potholes, etc?

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#888

Post by dham »

nkrisc wrote: post #291
hshshshshsh wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think one of the reasons they focus only on vision is basically the entire transportation infra is designed using human eyes a primary way to channel information. Useful information for driving are communicated through images in form of road signs, traffic signals etc.

I dunno, knowing the exact relative velocity of the car in front of you seems like it could be useful and is something humans can’t do very well. I’ve always wanted a car that shows my speed and the relative speed (+/-) of the car in front of me. My car’s cruise control can maintain a set distance so obviously it’s capable of it but it doesn’t show it.

If your car is maintaining speed of the car in front then the car in front is going speed that is showing on your speedometer.

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#889

Post by dham »

botanical wrote: post #52

Only the US government can allow corporations to beta test unproven technology on the public. Governments should carry out comprehensive tests on a self-driving car's claimed capabilities. This is the same as cars without proven passenger safety (Euro NCAP) aren't allowed to be on roads carrying passengers.

Uhh, have you heard of the FDA? It's approved hundreds of chemicals that are put in all of food. And we're not talking about a few deaths, we're talking hundreds of thousands if not millions.

Re: US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

#890

Post by dham »

whamlastxmas wrote: post #3
jqpabc123 wrote: post #2

By now, most people have probably heard that Tesla's attempt at "Full Self Driving" is really anything but --- after a decade of promises. The vehicle owners manual spells this out. As I understand it, the contentious issue is the fact that unlike most others, their attempt works mostly from visual feedback. In low visibility situations, their FSD has limited feedback and is essentially driving blind. It appears that…

It’s really weird how much you comment about FSD being fake. My Tesla drives me 10+ miles daily and the only time I touch any controls is pulling in and out of my garage. Literally daily. I maybe disengage once every couple days just to be on the safe side in uncertain situations, it I’m sure it’d likely do fine there too. FSD works. It drives itself fine 99.99% of the time. It is better than most human drivers. I do…

It's similar to when DHH said they were not bundling code in production and all the Javascript bros said "No you can't do that it won't work". DHH was like "yes but I'm doing it"

That's how it feels in FSD land right now. Everyone's saying FSD doesn't work and it'll never be here, but I'm literally using it every day lol.

Post reply on HN