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Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

reuters.com

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Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#881

Post by throwaway894345 »

talentedcoin wrote: post #870
throwaway894345 wrote: post #795

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think your standard for “peaceful protest” seems unreasonable. How many large scale protests have there been which had zero reports of “bad behavior”? Can you name any protest in the last 5 years whose scale was comparable to these protests which had no reports of bad behavior?

That’s a fair point. The way I see it is: 1) This is pretty severe by Canadian standards (we don’t have the same kind of protest culture the US does), but more importantly, 2) If nobody was driving their trucks up to Parliament Hill (and if the demands the protestors were initially making weren’t as wild — although obviously there’s room to disagree, as we have here, regarding how serious they are), then I would agre…

> This is pretty severe by Canadian standards (we don’t have the same kind of protest culture the US does), but more importantly,

Fair enough. Prior to BLM the US protest culture was much milder as well. :/

> However, I think what’s happening now has moved somewhat beyond what we should tolerate.

I can empathize with the frustration of traffic and noise disruption, but I don’t think it’s a good idea to set the precedent of giving the PM the power to suppress his own critics peacefully protesting.

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#882

Post by lern_too_spel »

mastazi wrote: post #867
lern_too_spel wrote: post #842

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a fully vaccinated person who understands that the point of every law in a democratic society is for the benefit of everybody (including myself) at the expense of my own liberty, I am proud that my name is not on that list. When you increase community immunity, you can reduce a pandemic to an endemic (a disease that causes only a few hospitalizations each year and doesn't threaten rationing care). This means busin…

> the point of every law in a democratic society is for the benefit of everybody provably false. So are you saying that my parents and grandparents, who went on strike and participated in worker unions, were wrong, and that they should have accepted labour laws as they were back then, since those laws were conceived in a democratic society hence they were fair by definition? > When you increase community immunity we…

> So are you saying that my parents and grandparents, who went on strike and participated in worker unions, were wrong, and that they should have accepted labour laws as they were back then, since those laws were conceived in a democratic society hence they were fair by definition?

No, I'm saying that democracies choose the laws to benefit the people who live in them, as opposed to dictatorships. Sometimes, the people in the democracies aren't smart enough to choose laws that benefit them (like the US states that made laws against vaccine mandates and had predictable healthcare rationing as a result), but that doesn't change the purpose of the democracy or its laws.

> we already have that, in many advanced economies

And those advanced economies are free to open up. Denmark already has. Canada, whether by having too low a vaccination rate or too little healthcare, is not among them. Hence, the need for mandates to get there.

> preventing someone from having a barbie on a certain day vs. firing someone from their job - not exactly two comparable situations

You're comparing a law with a punishment for breaking a law, which is a nonsensical comparison, as you apparently agree, but why make it? The key comparison is whether both laws are beneficial, and they are.

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#883

Post by toofy »

j_walter wrote: post #462
purephase wrote: post #447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've said this before. There's a strong libertarian bent to HN and I'm not surprised if there's a large contingent of this site that actively supports the convoy. There's people here that are strong supports of Peter Thiel, if that's any indication of where their sympathies lie. But, most of them are not residents of Ottawa, and the lived experiences of people in that city, particurlarly those who have had run ins wi…

>A city is being held hostage by an extreme minority and, even in OPs post they mention that the Toronto police handled it properly, but question the admonition levied against the Ottawa police. >The Ottawa police are complicit in this now as well as city council. They sat on their hands while allowing this to spiral out of control, and now want to play the victim or blame others (e.g. blaming counter protesters toda…

> Not much media coverage..

oh this is absurd.

BLM was the lead story in just about every newspaper, news channel, magazine and aggregator sites for weeks.

I noticed on a sibling comment you claim to live near Portland and implied that local media did minimal coverage which is also absurd. Again, it was covered obsessively by just about every single local news outlets from their local networks, papers, and podcasts.

No media outlet was trying to hide BLM from you.

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#884

Post by mastazi »

lern_too_spel wrote: post #882
mastazi wrote: post #867

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the point of every law in a democratic society is for the benefit of everybody provably false. So are you saying that my parents and grandparents, who went on strike and participated in worker unions, were wrong, and that they should have accepted labour laws as they were back then, since those laws were conceived in a democratic society hence they were fair by definition? > When you increase community immunity we…

> So are you saying that my parents and grandparents, who went on strike and participated in worker unions, were wrong, and that they should have accepted labour laws as they were back then, since those laws were conceived in a democratic society hence they were fair by definition? No, I'm saying that democracies choose the laws to benefit the people who live in them, as opposed to dictatorships. Sometimes, the peopl…

> The key comparison is whether both laws are beneficial, and they are

Something something "Dei Delitti e Delle Pene"

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#885

Post by mwarkentin »

pyuser583 wrote: post #831
ahthat wrote: post #683

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Media coverage of these protests is vastly negative. I remember only a few years ago (2020) when protests were undoubtedly violent across the United States. Video evidence of this violence as well as mass crowd driven theft was widely documented and distributed. I have yet to see video evidence of any violence from freedom convoys, and the ground based video evidence I have seen appears vastly peaceful. This does not…

Near where I live, one of the BLM protestors tried to burn down the local 911 center. He’s currently in prison for arson. Haven’t seen anything like that in this protest, but honestly I haven’t been looking too close.

Obviously a lot of details unknown at this point, but: https://globalnews.ca/news/8600592/trucker-convoy-police-inv...

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#886

Post by [deleted] »

j_walter wrote: post #614
oo0shiny wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Andy Ngo isn't exactly a reliable source. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andy_Ngo#Credibility

He posts video...how is raw video not a reliable source? He certainly has an agenda, but also posts things that many will not. He was not afraid to post video when the actual news teams were threatened and attacked during the riots (by specific groups that you can't really talk about since they don't exist...it's just an idea).

[deleted]

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#887

Post by mwarkentin »

blast wrote: post #585
ar_turnbull wrote: post #570

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "there is no violence, and no obvious danger." This is false and I would expect better of HN posters. A group of the protestors locked the doors to a downtown apartment building with handcuffs and then attempted to set that building on fire. Although nobody has been injured yet, there have been plenty of weapons seizures as well as incidents of protestors ramming police vehicles and/or attempting to arrest police o…

> A group of the protestors locked the doors to a downtown apartment building with handcuffs and then attempted to set that building on fire. What evidence is there that that was real? An allegation was made on Twitter, but only thing I've found that digs into the details looks like a complete debunking (see links at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30336974 ). It's from a biased source and I'm open to any factua…

News report (investigation ongoing so details not really clear): https://globalnews.ca/news/8600592/trucker-convoy-police-inv...

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#888

Post by Teever »

glennvtx wrote: post #829
II2II wrote: post #810

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Furthermore, it can be effectively argued that forcing workers to get vaccinated or lose their jobs is inherently discriminatory and perhaps even anti-freedom. From my understanding, this is only the case for truckers crossing the border. Most of the vaccination mandates I have heard of have been at the provincial or municipal levels and only affect employees of the government or publicly controlled institutions (h…

It is not the employers that are demanding these people be vaccinated, They just want their products delivered. The government wont allow drivers to cross an imaginary line without submitting to vaccination: an even more egregious trespass of an individuals liberty than their usual practice of extortion and/or delay.

Do you actually think that referring to borders as 'imaginary lines' is productive? Like do you think that it ads to the conversation, or persuades people to agree with you?

Why do you do it?

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#889

Post by 8note »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #550
ceejayoz wrote: post #439

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These protests have been literally “mostly peaceful” no? That's fair, yes. Economically disruptive, but largely peaceful. I'd wager the left isn't going to pass "it's legal to run over protesters" in response to these, though. https://www.vox.com/2021/4/25/22367019/gop-laws-oklahoma-iow...

From your own overtly biased link: > Under the new law, an Oklahoma driver will no longer be liable for striking — or even killing — a person if the driver is “fleeing from a riot ... under a reasonable belief that fleeing was necessary to protect the motor vehicle operator from serious injury or death.” Super disingenuous to characterize that as "it's legal to run over protesters".

The person you drove over doesn't get to give an alternative story to this necessity, nor do they have to be somebody that you're fleeing from.

I don't think it's reasonable to defend yourself from somebody by going up to a passer by and shooting them

Re: Names of Canada truck convoy donors leaked after reported hack

#890

Post by jjulius »

fredophile wrote: post #878
jjulius wrote: post #456

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So you think it's acceptable for citizens in one country to fund political movements in other countries? Would you feel the same way about oligarchs in Russia or China funding political organizations in the US? Please don't be so quick to put words into other's mouths and then go after them for something they never said. Someone asked why another user might want to donate to political causes in another country. I re…

I didn't say you endorsed OPs views. You said that this was the same as someone in one part of the US funding political action in another part of the US. Apocryphon noted that Canada is a sovereign country and not part of the US. You replied that this didn't change the point of your original post. This implied that you don't see a distinction between funding political activity within your own country and funding poli…

>I didn't say you endorsed OPs views.

OP is a citizen in one country who donated to a political movement in another country. In discussing the "why" of that, you asked me:

>So you think it's acceptable for citizens in one country to fund political movements in other countries?

That's exactly what OP did. The manner in which you phrase your question, along with your follow up question that assumed my answer to the former would be, "Yes", strongly implies I have endorsed OP's views.

>You said that this was the same as someone in one part of the US funding political action in another part of the US. Apocryphon noted that Canada is a sovereign country and not part of the US. You replied that this didn't change the point of your original post. This implied that you don't see a distinction between funding political activity within your own country and funding political activity in another country and is independent of the OPs political stance.

One part of the US funding political action in another US state; someone in Brazil funding political action in India; someone on the moon funding political action on Venus. The point is that $PERSON1 from $REGION1 may feel that $POLITICALMOVEMENT in $REGION2 holds a lot of views that $PERSON1 strongly believes in, and as such they want to donate to them. This is backed up by OP's response confirming shared views. That's what was asked - why donate to another country? - and all I did was given a reason why, named locales be damned.

Now, I can grant that state-to-state and country-to-country are different things. That said, for the sake of a quick example pulled out of my ass, it worked; you're just unable to see the forest for the trees.

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