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FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

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Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#871

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Salami slicing is the first page of the present day authoritarian play book. Here's an excerpt from They Thought They Were Free , a book about the mindset of ordinary Germans experiencing the rise of the Nazi Government: Each act, each occasion, is worse than the last, but only a little worse. You wait for the next and the next. You wait for one great shocking occasion, thinking that others, when such a shock comes,…

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why do you think it's turning people against them?

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#872

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You are taking ICE's/the administration's perspective and assuming it is cogent which leads you to conclusion that doesn't support justice and instead supports the end of constitutional rule in the US. No I'm not. I'm taking the facts as they're presented by the AP (which is famously not sympathetic to this administration) and saying that nothing in the facts that I'm seeing here in this specific case serves as evi…

The truth is somewhere in the middle. There was a similar case in Massachusetts many years back. It never went to trial, and legal analysis could go both ways. The bargain struct was it would go into secretive judicial oversight channels. There is a strong case to be made for obstruction of justice, and an equally strong case to be made about her making an error in her professional capacity as a judge and a governmen…

What was the honest mistake the judge made?

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#873

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I remain horrified that people I really thought were normal Americans are willing to burn it all down just so they don't have to hear Spanish spoken in their doctor's office. Calling people who are against illegal immigration "racist" just makes it worse. A majority of people are fine with legal migration, a supermajority of people think illegal immigrants should get deported. So no, the issue most see isn't that t…

As far as the Republican Party, statistics don’t back up the idea they are okay with legal immigration. https://globalaffairs.org/research/public-opinion-survey/rep... In Florida, Desantis is so against legal migration he is trying to relax child labor laws. Even now there is a share of Republicans especially in southern states who are still against interracial marriages. https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/in…

>Half of Republicans (50%) say legal immigration into the United States should be decreased.

This is a far shot from being against legal migration entirely.

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#874
post #833

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After due process via courts, deportation is justified. Yes? >> if (person.citizenStatus == illegal && person.citizenStatus in police.knowledge()) { deport(person, police) After due process citizen status is in police knowledge, right? So they're illegal, ICE knows it, and our flow chart says... deport. Which condition do you believe is not satisfied? Do you believe the status of the person is not "illegal"? If so,…

You're assuming that `police.knowledge` is sourced from an infallible oracle, and that the code is being executed by a fully trustworthy party. This isn't the case in practice. You need a giant try-catch around the whole thing, with the person being targeted being able to trigger an exception and force a re-evaluation at any point. That's what the basic human rights are for - placing those deep inside a nested if-sta…

  > You're assuming that `police.knowledge` is sourced from an infallible oracle
I thought it was clear we cannot assume police knowledge is infallible. Sure, let's refactor to `police.knowledge` is now `police.belief`. I do not think this changes things.

  > You need a giant try-catch around the whole thing
Sure, I agree here too. In fact, everything was predicated on this! It is all predicated on things not always working!

  >>>> The logic works just fine if you recognize that it is impossible to achieve 100% success rate. It is absolutely insane to me that on a website full of engineers people do not consider failure analysis when it comes to laws.
The point was to show that there is no good logic for not doing this. I disagreed that you can only reach the conclusion that Sanctuary Cities are a good idea "IF AND ONLY IF" you view illegal immigrants as humans. That's incorrect. The conclusion is still valid even if you dehumanize them and are looking out for yourself.

  >>>> Seems like you could be completely selfish, hate illegal immigrants, AND benefit through policies of Sanctuary Cities and giving them TINs
Certainly we should make this far more robust if we are to actually deploy it. Hell, most of my functions don't even execute anything! They just have comments! Critique it all you want, there's a shit ton wrong if we want to try to execute it. But I was writing fucking pseudocode for the explicit purpose of discussion. Hell yeah there's a lot more conditional statements, catches, interrupts, loops, and all sorts of stuff that needs to happen prior to the pseudocode takes place. But the fuck do you want from me? A link to a GitHub project with a fully fleshed out legal framework that's bulletproof and written in rust? We're trying to have a conversation here. Even if I did that no one is going to read that here. To have a conversation we need to at least have good faith interpretation of one another. Hell, that's one of those conditionals that even precedes our conditional logic!

And, aren't we on the same fucking side? What the hell are you yelling at me for when a good faith interpretation of my comment reads in agreement with your response?! There's absolutely nothing I wrote that I'm lacking knowledge of basic human rights.

Were you confused because I wrote "I disagree" in response to hypeatei? Did you assume I disagreed with their point? Because I was in agreement. The part I disagreed with was the "only works if you consider illegal immigrants as people" part. I apologize, I dropped the "only" in the quote, but something seriously went wrong if that misstep results in a complete misinterpretation. My point is that even if you dehumanize illegal immigrants[0], Sanctuary Cities are *STILL* a good decision. I do not think it is hard to reach the conclusion that I'm saying "There is no good logic in which a Sanctuary City is not a good idea." What is going on here?! Are we just fighting for the sake of fighting?!

[0] I need to be *ABSOLUTELY CLEAR* that I am not condoning this!

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#875
post #755

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> obstructed an arrest by changing standard procedure Which sounds awfully novel to me. You really want to tear down the structure of democracy over this kind of nitpicking on "procedure"? I remain horrified that people I really thought were normal Americans are willing to burn it all down just so they don't have to hear Spanish spoken in their doctor's office.

> I remain horrified that people I really thought were normal Americans are willing to burn it all down just so they don't have to hear Spanish spoken in their doctor's office. Calling people who are against illegal immigration "racist" just makes it worse. A majority of people are fine with legal migration, a supermajority of people think illegal immigrants should get deported. So no, the issue most see isn't that t…

> A majority of people are fine with legal migration

an alarming number of legal aliens are being detained, deported or disappeared: students who wrote op-eds, Afghan asylees who helped us during the war, college professors and Canadian tourists, even (prospectively) "home-growns."

if most Trump supporters support legal migration, why aren't they pushing back on this?

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#876

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a real news story with a real arrest on a real judge. There is no hypothetical here.

Yes, but the judge has not been shipped to El Salvador in the middle of the night. Resolving the matter in court _is due process_.

They're not resolving it in court. You can issue summons, which is NORMALLY what happens when these kind of issues arise.

The "Cash for Children" judges got summons for Christ's sake.

Pam Bondi mere hours ago stated they would go after more judges like this. This isn't normal or right.

You're clearly not interested in good-faith discussion, good bye.

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#877
post #871

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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why do you think it's turning people against them?

> "why do you think it's turning people against them?"

March 31, 2025: "Democrats’ approval remains at low point: Poll" - https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/5224072-de...

April 4, 2025: "President Donald Trump's approval rating has risen by 5 percentage points among Democrats, according to new polling" - https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-approval-rating-update...

So how is all the raucous handwringing helping?

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#878

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I said minorities, not "illegal immigrants" many minorities otherwise here legally are also being persecuted

> many minorities otherwise here legally are also being persecuted Can you name one minority group that is being persecuted and have to hide? If you mean people critical of Trump then that is not a minority group, at least not in this context. It is wrong to deport them for that, but that isn't the same as "hunting down minorities".

> Can you name one minority group that is being persecuted

Sure: Immigrants.

Also: International students, especially Palestinians who support their friends and family in Palestine.

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#879

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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Indeed. And they have floated "deporting" citizens for "crimes".

They have made it clear how they are treating immigrants is how they want to treat citizens.

If you think the citizens they are targeting are "the bad ones", you just wait. Soon the "bad ones" category will get wider was well.

Someone wrote a poem about this once. Their back story is very, very relevant.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_They_Came

Re: FBI arrests judge accused of helping man evade immigration authorities

#880

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> we don't ignore their crime And no one is asking the relevant authorities to ignore their duties to enforce immigration policy. They're just saying that state and local courts and police aren't the relevant authorities, and that they'd prefer to have the rest of the apparatus of government function with and for undocumented people.

> And no one is asking the relevant authorities to ignore their duties to enforce immigration policy. I take a look at Los Angeles policy, which was recently ensconced into law, and it does specifically require authorities to ignore their duties. It even requires them to interfere in them. They cannot, even if if they incidentally know a persons immigration status, contact immigration authorities with that informatio…

No one is required to ignore their duties, because immigration enforcement is not the duty of anyone bound by a City of Los Angeles ordinance. No one is required to interfere with federal law enforcement pursuing actual criminals under a judicial warrant. No one is prevented from making whatever claims they might want to federal authorities in their personal capacity; they just can't investigate immigration status under the pretext of city business, or use city resources for unintended purposes.

which is all good! I want people to confidently report crimes committed against them. I want restaurants to be health-inspected without staff worrying about questions of status. I want people to get pulled over and cited for traffic violations without having to ask existential questions about their presence in the country or consider rash actions as a result.

City and State governments have precisely zero authority over who lives within their borders. The past several decades of federal vacillation have got us to this point. The federal government can spend its own time and money to sort it out. Until then LAPD, LASD, CHP, etc. are expensive enough; let them focus on enforcing the local and state laws they're responsible for as equitably as they can for _all_ the people living there.

also:

> document them on their own terms?

We do? e.g. AB 60 driver's licenses

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