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10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

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Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#871
post #760

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After spending a couple weeks in Cuba it’s not hard to see why. Which is the consequence of being sanctioned into oblivion for decades by the global hegemon, much to the dislike of the entire rest of the world.

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typical uneducated american viewpoint.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#872
post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m always deeply uncomfortable with this argument. It sounds like justification for a “slave” class to do undesirable jobs with no legal protections and sub minimum wage, just so Americans can save a few bucks at the supermarket. But at what moral cost? We can’t have it both ways—if they’re here working, then it needs to be at full American wage with full American regulation/oversight. But that itself defeats the pu…

Part of what perpetuates this sort of thing is a general idea in society that one can’t do or learn something because that’s not possible for them. I’m of the opinion that if sufficiently motivated and with sufficient constraints removed, anyone can learn and do anything. The only difference between an engineer and someone breaking their back for work is that the engineer was probably coddled from birth into being to…

If you believe that anyone can do anything, you have never done something properly difficult and watched yourself and / or others fail despite trying hard.

Inappropriate dissuasion surely exists, but you don't help your case by making such claims.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#873

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Republican anti-immigrant platform because it seems to me there is significant brain drain from many countries to the U.S. and that contributes to our success. Explain how unskilled illegal immigrants contribute to our success. I'm open minded but I've yet to hear anything convincing. No one is opposed to the legal immigration of skilled workers.

Many are arguing the case for the net economic value of immigrant labor which I agree is a fairly compelling case. I'd like to offer an alternate avenue of attack, however: population trends. Without immigration, U.S. population growth would be well below replacement rate. This is a growing problem throughout the entire developed world with no fair answers -- increasingly, it looks as though the next several decades…

>Without immigration, U.S. population growth would be well below replacement rate. This is a growing problem throughout the entire developed world with no fair answers

We are living in a death cult(ure), we arent reproducing maybe for economic conditions as in most developed countries wages have compressed in real terms and people prefer to have less if none kids than to lower their lifestile below what they were born into, maybe is the anti-family culture that permeates society, seiing the nuclear family as a burden to personal fullment, woman independence, career obstacle, problem for the enviroment or the miriad of other factors.

Importing migrants is just a band aid that moves the problems of our unhealthy society few years down the line, we need to focus on our dying societies.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#874

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> History and data from various European nations suggest that some immigrant groups aren't able to integrate with the host society after multiple generations, and remain ghettoized with low employment and high crime rates (vastly higher, for certain categories of crime). I'm not sure that's true. For example, in the United States, it took numerous generations of German-Americans to fully integrate into society, with…

Different immigrant groups have better or worse outcomes, hence my saying "some immigrant groups". The cultural distance between the English progenitors of the US to the large wave of German immigrants in the 1800s is not as great as, say, that of Turkish immigrants to Germany post-WW2, or Syrian immigrants to contemporary Denmark. Another way to look at it is that immigrant groups bring parts of their old world with…

> German-Americans left a high-social-trust, low-crime culture

Did they? I can't speak to the crime rate of the German empire, but a very common reason to immigrate, in addition to availability of farm land, was to avoid the draft (low social trust). The slow rate of assimilation is also a signal that these were not people coming from a "high-social-trust" background.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#875

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a British immigrant in Germany and I can vouch for how impossible it is to integrate into these northern European societies, if the rest are anything like Germany. I tick all the boxes of what German boomers would want in a "Good Immigrant" (white, educated, from western Europe, speaks German, good job), but it doesn't help. I think overall Germans, deep down, don't really want us here. We are here to pay for th…

While being an exchange student in Asia I met an Austrian girl studying in Germany. Her best friend was Iranian-German, born and raised in Germany. When they both tried to apply for renting places close to Uni, several times her Iranian-German friend was ignored by the land lords. Even though the Austrian girl had heavy accent and technically being the migrant, her "germanic" name and white face gave her access to th…

Yeah this is extremely common, surnames are probably the single most important thing in Germany when it comes to finding quality housing. Actually the housing market in Germany is really bad, somehow seemingly even worse than the British one, albeit in different ways. All the Germans I know live really well, because finding somewhere to live is more about connections ("Vitamin B", Genossenschaft, friend/colleague "giving" you their contract/flat) and being German (so you're not filtered based on your surname) than anything else. Of course, if you're an immigrant then you're unlikely to have connections, and it's unlikely your dad signed you up to a Genossenschaft 20 years ago.

Some Germans may like to think of Germany as a country of immigrants, but it just isn't, regardless of how many live here.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#876

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying that the massive multi-decade US sanctions had no impact?

They are saying that if the many ways that socialist countries have failed, there is always a hundred different excuses for why that specific example of failure doesn't "count". If your system is incapable of dealing with any sort of adversity, then that is failure of the system. All countries around the world have problems. And yet, most countries are able to deal with them. Unlikely, apparently, every major sociali…

I have zero affection for the Castro regime, but it’s disingenous to characterize a multi-decade embargo by the closest trading partner, which is also a superpower, as “any kind of adversity” as if it were merely a bad harvest.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#877

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a British immigrant in Germany and I can vouch for how impossible it is to integrate into these northern European societies, if the rest are anything like Germany. I tick all the boxes of what German boomers would want in a "Good Immigrant" (white, educated, from western Europe, speaks German, good job), but it doesn't help. I think overall Germans, deep down, don't really want us here. We are here to pay for th…

I - a white German - got verbally attacked in the subway of Berlin by a man because I looked somehow foreign to him... So even being white and German sometimes doesn't help... Being from the wrong side of the village can be bad enough. Integration is hard - I recently went to an intergration event at a local church - almost no Germans there - and also the different foreign communities didn't really interact with each…

I really think you're right. Actually I do truly believe everyone suffers under the prevailing German attitude towards social contact and human interaction. It's just worse for immigrants, because we've even more outsiders and often visibly so.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#878

I support immigration and oppose the Republican anti-immigrant platform because it seems to me there is significant brain drain from many countries to the U.S. and that contributes to our success. For example, in this article is about white collar crime, it points out that many Somali-Americans were professionals back in Somalia. I'm not concerned about the crime because that seems like a somewhat higher tendency unt…

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Yeah, fast changing demographics means fast changing values.People that come in mass from failing or disfunctional or just very different societies can and do bring with them "incompatible" values. Us modern ability to integrate / assimilate people in mass is probably ovverated, expecially in a fast paced mass migration scenario of a multiethnic society. the future is probably some version of Brazil

Usa got lucky integrating most europeans first and skilled immigrants later. but it struggled with other demographics, notably afro-americans, native americans

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#879

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I should be clear... I'm not talking about Nordic countries regarding Jews. Swedes, Norwegians and Danes are considered heroes in this regard, and the historical analogies to the rest of Western Europe don't hold. There was no history of ghettoization or discrimination there. I am not applying my criticism there. It should be said that the pre-WW2 Jewish population of Sweden was miniscule, but that Swedes took great…

French Jew here. I agree that our social, educational and cultural institutions are doing an absolutely atrocious job of integrating immigrant populations. Despite that, I find that most people I know from the Maghreb are actually quite well integrated, mostly because as an educated, well-to-do person I hang around with other educated, well-to-do people and they tend to be quite nice to get along with. I grew up in H…

I feel you are a bit harsh in this last comparison, this poor Perl codebase doesn't deserve such a stigmatization as to low it down at the level of systematic failure constructed by several generations of incompetent wannabe elite of the country regardless of continuous demonstration of total inability to take a single decision that make sense in regard to the goals of the mandate they are supposed to fulfill.

At least no one can pretend that Larry was missing the skills to handle the job, Perl community neither laked dedication on par with the flowing resources, and what they build still make stand a significant part of the internet diligently.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#880

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's really underselling the political persecution that many have suffered in Cuba. It's far and away from just wanting reparations for land grabs. We have sanctions on Cuba for the same reason we have sanctions on Russia and Venezuela now- we don't want to fund what their government is doing, and allying with them gives us little to nothing in return. That said, it's pretty obvious that economic sanctions…

> we don't want to fund what their government is doing What is their government doing that is so terrible? Anyway let's suppose Cuba is a brutal dictatorship, even though it really isn't by any metric. Why are there no sanctions on Saudi Arabia? Why no sanctions on Taiwan during the white terror? Why no sanctions on Chile when they threw alive protesters from flying helicopters? I could go on for a while.

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