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U.S. science is in chaos

scientificamerican.com

861–870 of 1001 posts

Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#861

> But arbitrary cancellations and delayed disbursements are unprecedented. And justifying them on the basis of politics—prohibiting, for instance, grants that include language referencing diversity, equity and inclusion (DEI)—was unheard of until now. It is odd how removal of DEI is framed as being political, when it is the other way round. DEI schemes were deeply political, and depended on who can claim to be the bi…

I don't think DEI was political until Trump made it a dog whistle for white nationalism? Insofar as Trump platformed white nationalists, I suppose it's political, but you are confusing the causality.

Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#862

My wife operates an optical trap (a sophisticated microscope, she uses it for studying gene/dna physical properties) and she's pretty good at working with that instrument. The number of people good at working that microscope are in the ballpark of 2000 (+- 1000) in the world! She has cried a lot in the last one year for the mess science research has become. We are moving out of the country at the end of August.

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Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#863
post #652

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Higher intangible quality of life, lower spending power. There are a lot of QOL advantages to living in a less violent, less polarized, less cruelty-driven society that isn't actively trying to dismantle all of its institutions and destroy itself. Especially if you're one of those people who are in the crosshairs of jack-booted thugs and their cheerleaders.

There are a lot of QOL disadvantages to being an immigrant on a visa anywhere. I moved to NZ for the next couple of years recently, and my QOL has dropped in many ways from the move. My much lower income buys a lot less housing here, so I went from a 2 bed apartment to myself to a moldy studio. I'm extremely far from family and friends, and there are weird cultural gaps with most everyone around me because we grew up…

Everything you have said here is also quite true.

For many people, it does get better with time, though.

Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#864

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We are moving out of the country at the end of August. Is the assertion there are no places for her to enjoy doing what she's great at, without leaving the country, in private industry? Genuinely curious.

Fair question - our concerns are multidimensional. Funding cut + Visa uncertainty + ICE arresting us and putting us in detention + us visiting another country but not being allowed to enter back are a few of them.

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Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#865
post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's the coordinated dismantling of structural components of America's innovation economy in ways that will take decades to recover from, No, that is just your opinion.

I'm not the big Lebowski but this is the "opinion" of the majority of scientific societies in the US as well as watchdog organizations who have long followed science regulatory and spending action. It's not exactly new. We've been through this with the crackdown on climate science during the W Bush administration, with sequestration during the early/mid 2010's, and with the budget shenanigans during the first Trump a…

So that is their, possibly biased, opinion.

Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#866

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not much talent is going from US to Canada, it's almost always the reverse if you look at top canadian universities

Here’s evidence from 2025. 2026 has increased. https://www.aau.edu/sites/default/files/Resources-American-S...

Canadians/dual citizens moving back?

Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#867

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not much talent is going from US to Canada, it's almost always the reverse if you look at top canadian universities

US citizen moves to Canada on a CUSMA visa: - 30-50% pay cut - points and lottery based immigration system that penalizes them for each year you age after 30 - frequent unfavorable rule changes - fear of being trapped forever on a temporary visa and eventually sent back to the USA, poorer than their peers who stayed stateside. Canadian citizen moves to us on equivalent CUSMA visa: - huge pay raise - retire back home…

>US citizen moves to Canada on a CUSMA visa: - 30-50% pay cut

But what about "free healthcare". Don't americans want socialized healthcare over their despised privatized system?

> - points and lottery based immigration system that penalizes them for each year you age after 30

Many countries with socialized healthcare do this. They only want young people and don't want older people who are a risk at becoming a burden to the state before they paid a lot into the system. After a certain age or health status, many workers, even locals not just immigrants, start to become a net negative to the welfare state, consuming more resources in care than they contribute back, so you need a constant stream of young healthy workers to keep the ponzi scheme going.

US being private healthcare doesn't give a damn since your health conditions are your own problem.

>Canada's immigration system is just structurally tilted toward brain drain. It's all stick and no carrot.

And yet they have record immigration rates, mostly from india. So it seems there's plenty of desperate people on the planet that don't even need a carrot, they prefer the Canadian stick because the situation back in their home is so much worse than the canadian stick.

However, I do think that if you're relying on a stream of desperate people from all over the world to replenish your own brain drain because you manage to push away your most valuable people, then you're doing it wrong and it's not gonna be sustainable, you're just putting band aids on major structural issues to cover the rot, and eventuall y the piper will have to be paid.

Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#868

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you want more than the firing? If a CEO commits a crime does that mean the entire industry must ne shut down? What sort of reasoning is this?

Broken window theory to the extreme. If the leader of one of the countries most famous research groups commited research fraud with a slap on the wrist it's not hard to realize how broken it is. I have personally worked with famous researchers and seen a few fudge their work. Acting ignorant of the major flaws implies you haven't been involved, or inside a bubble of research nirvana.

This should apply to politics and industry as well then, in your opinion? Cut all subsidies for industries that commit fraud, research or otherwise, like the oil giants for example? No pardons for cryptocurrency Ceo's like CZ and shutdown cryptocurrency?

Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#869

My wife operates an optical trap (a sophisticated microscope, she uses it for studying gene/dna physical properties) and she's pretty good at working with that instrument. The number of people good at working that microscope are in the ballpark of 2000 (+- 1000) in the world! She has cried a lot in the last one year for the mess science research has become. We are moving out of the country at the end of August.

There are many biotech startups and private research labs thriving and paying high salaries with excellent benefits for that specialty right now - focused on genetic testing, editing, and longevity. Before moving abroad, widening the search outside of academia and considering moving internally might be worthwhile.

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Re: U.S. science is in chaos

#870

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Academic experience typically doesn't count." Why not?

> Why not? Weird egos. I moved from academia to industry and constantly got told "In industry we just care that 'it works'". I thought that was a weird premise, given... you know... who doesn't? But the more time I spent in industry the more time I found that they in fact do not care if it actually works. What seems to matter more is the politics and about "working"[0] the right way using the right new buzzword[1] Tr…

>Fun fact, my boss also loved to tell me about how dumb academia is because they never do anything useful and how industry makes all the real advancements.

He's not entirely wrong though. Industry makes the advancements that actually supposed to sell and be profitable on the free market. Academia is all over the place, as not everything being researched there can be used commercially, often it's just to get grant money, push papers and raise their egos amongst their peers.

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