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Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

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Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#861

Post by hef19898 »

golergka wrote: post #858
hef19898 wrote: post #823

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure what want to say, but here some dates, courtesy of wiki: - Hamas won 42.5% in the elections in 2006, no elections took place since - Hamas support was not strong, based in the few pols done, it increased after Israels attack And the last bit what is so not surprising. Edit: If you are interested in how we ended up with this cluster fuck, wikipedia is good place. Start way back so, in 50s, to get the necessar…

[flagged]

Genozid and ethinic cleansing are not an act of self defence. That people fail to see that is troublesome.

And no, I won't go back to King David and the Romans. The current conflict between Palestinians and Israel can be traced back to right after WW2. That's were the interesting events start. Going back further is not helpful.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#862

Post by dang »

syngrog66 wrote: post #720

This is totally off-topic and inappropriate for "Hacker News" please dont let this site drift further away

HN's approach to this kind of story has been stable for many years. There's no long-term drift [1], but there are random fluctuations, which often raise fears of a long-term drift [2].

If you want more explanation, see my post https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39618973 earlier in this thread, and the links back from there. If you read some of those and have a question I haven't already answered, I'd be happy to take a crack at it.

[1] I say that because we're conscious of what the principles governing this are, and it's possible to apply them fairly consistently.

[2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17014869

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#863

Post by dang »

GordonS wrote: post #683
rendall wrote: post #675

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is revisionist history - Gaza was never even part of Egypt So confident and yet so wrong. This is literally history. Are you pro-Hamas because you don't know the history of the region, or do you not know the history region because you're motivated to ignore it where it contradicts your pro-Hamas narrative? From whom did Israel seize control of Gaza in 1967?

[flagged]

I appreciate your more substantive contributions to the thread, but you've also broken the site guidelines a lot, such as by accusing others of not commenting in good faith. Can you please edit that sort of thing out of your HN posts in the future? I know it's not easy in the heat of the moment, but it's critical to the survival of this site, and it will also make your own posts a lot more persuasive.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#864

Post by falcor84 »

marcosdumay wrote: post #775
falcor84 wrote: post #723

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Point taken. But I'm still wondering where we should be drawing the line. For example, Russia has arguably not had fair and free elections for over two decades, so should we refrain from saying that there's a war between Russia and Ukraine and instead say that there's a war between Putin's party (United Russia) and Ukraine"?

If you believe Russians are somehow to blame for this war, you are completely deluded. Some (many) tens of thousands of people were arrested for complaining... But don't bother, their punishment was only half a year or so in prision... And in unrelated news, some (many) tens of thousands of Russian prisoners were sent to die at the Ukraine winter, on the frontline, without guns or even socks. But no, all Russians are…

I apologize if that's what I implied, that was not my intent; I'm definitely not looking to put blame on regular Russians or anyone else.

I'm just asking a naive geopolitical question of whether we should in general be talking about countries being at war (and I just offered Russia vs Ukraine as an example), or whether it's more appropriate to think of wars as being between leaderships/militaries, whereas the rest of either country should be considered generally uninvolved? Or if "it depends", where should that line be?

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#865

Post by dang »

gryzzly wrote: post #656
GordonS wrote: post #653

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not Reddit, and I won't be engaging any further with you. Good bye.

everyone can see enough of what you wrote, bbye.

You broke the site guidelines badly and repeatedly in this thread. We have to ban accounts that do that. Regardless of how right you are or feel you are, please don't do this again.

Others have been breaking the site guidelines too, of course, and I'm posting moderation replies to a few of them—it's not possible to respond to them all. I just mention this to make clear that the moderation in this case has nothing to do with which side you're arguing for or against. It has to do with your obviously breaking HN's rules, which is not ok.

If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#866

Post by dang »

rendall wrote: post #675
GordonS wrote: post #662

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Did you know that Israel tried to give Gaza back to Egypt and West Bank back to Jordan? This is revisionist history - Gaza was never even part of Egypt! [0] Netanyahu's plans for "Greater Israel" (which includes the West Bank and Gaza) also run contrary to this claim. > Israel doesn't want it Israel's actions say otherwise. And let's not forget that Israel continues to illegally occupy land in Lebanon and Syria - t…

> This is revisionist history - Gaza was never even part of Egypt So confident and yet so wrong. This is literally history. Are you pro-Hamas because you don't know the history of the region, or do you not know the history region because you're motivated to ignore it where it contradicts your pro-Hamas narrative? From whom did Israel seize control of Gaza in 1967?

I appreciate your more substantive contributions to the thread, but you've also broken the site guidelines a lot, such as with snark and personal attacks. Can you please edit that sort of thing out of your HN posts in the future? I know it's not easy in the heat of the moment, but it's critical to the survival of this site, and it will also make your own posts a lot more persuasive.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Edit: we've had to ask you about this before, and not only about this topic.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38583206 (Dec 2023)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37648667 (Sept 2023)

Eventually we have no choice but to ban accounts that keep breaking HN's rules like this and ignore our requests to stop. I don't want to ban you, so if you would please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules, that would be good. You broke a great many of them here, including:

"Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive."

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#867

Post by dang »

rat9988 wrote: post #497
dang wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Edit: oh, you were asking about comments. In my haste I missed that and thought you were asking about submissions. There are lots of comments in this thread that aren't flagged, so discussion isn't being prevented. It's true that a lot of the earlier comments were flagged, but that was (or should be) because they were flamebait. It's one of the downsides of internet commenting that the flameiest and most reflexive co…

It's surprisingly dismissive. It's not that because not all of the comments aren't flagged that discussion isn't being prevented. And the (or should be) does most of the work when you talk about flagged are flagged because they were flamebait. I'm pretty sure it's not an easy task to moderate HN. But I'm still surprised by the answer here.

I'm sorry, but I don't follow your point here.

Keep in mind that I was commenting about the situation very early in the thread. My comment applies only to the very first comments that got posted—perhaps the first couple dozen—no later.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#868

Post by dang »

matsemann wrote: post #473
dang wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's a legit concern and it worries me too. We can only go by the articles that users submit, and then only the subset we see, which is a function of (a) randomness and (b) users bringing specific cases to our attention. If there's a bias in the stories that have made HN's front page, that bias is present in the underlying data (I mean this stream of articles) to begin with. Why might that be? Well, there are…

FWIW, it's also easy to claim HN is biased, because people are biased differently, and HN is close to global. As a northern european, I for instance would say that I often find HN trend conservative, compared to the discourses in my country. But someone from a different part of the world could claim HN to lean progressive, based on their political environment. So I don't think there is an easy way here. If one were t…

That's a really important point which is unfortunately barely understood at all. I tried to write about it here one time: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23308098.

The only thing I'd add to your point is that while HN is certainly global (or let's say highly international), the community is still overwhelmingly from Western countries. (Not all hold pro-Western views, of course, but that's different.) This means that users from non-Western countries who want to contribute views that go against what is commonly believed in the West, have a hard time. We do what we can to help, but unfortunately it's not much, because the forces of large numbers and group psychology are unstoppable, especially together.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#869

Post by dang »

gataca wrote: post #699
jay-barronville wrote: post #601

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Setting aside the fact that these are numbers provided by Hamas […] This is an unserious argument. 1. The numbers come from Gaza’s Ministry of Health, which is indeed “controlled” by Hamas since Hamas is their governing entity. 2. The Ministry has no verifiable history of being wrong on the civilian casualty numbers. In fact, it’s quite the opposite: The Ministry’s numbers have held up to scrutiny in ALL of the pre…

> The Ministry has no verifiable history of being wrong on the civilian casualty numbers This is laughable. They claimed that Israel bombed a hospital and killed 500 people that the Palestinians themselves bombed. You are either hopelessly biased and unserious or uninformed.

I'm afraid you broke the site guidelines repeatedly and very badly in this thread. That's not ok. You're welcome to make your substantive points while respecting HN's rules, and indeed they will become more persuasive if you do so. But please, no more snark, name-calling, personal attacks, or flamewar posts—no matter how right you are or feel you are, and no matter how divisive the topic.

If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#870

Post by [deleted] »

McNutty wrote: post #13
blurbleblurble wrote: post #6

I appreciate that this is on here and I hope we can collectively handle it. Tech isn't isolated from this situation, as difficult as it is to admit and talk about with civility and care. A US military software engineer even self immolated recently in protest of what's happening. I don't see what's happening in Gaza as being culturally particular to the specific identity groups involved here. It's a very human situati…

Strongly disagree. This platform for tech news should not become a place for political posts, nor even for posting regular news headlines. Yes we know that reddit sucks but stop trying to make hn into reddit. Also the community can't handle it, just look at the handful of comments we already have here.

[deleted]
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