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They Used To Last 50 Years

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Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#861

Post by com2kid »

therealmarv wrote: post #758
com2kid wrote: post #726

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Only plus side I can see is that it is faster... I enjoy being able to wash my blankets. When I had a front loader, it was impossible to get anything large clean, especially with how many fabrics here in America at least are all synthetic so water beads off rather than being adsorbed. The only way to clean cheap linen here is to completely immerse it in water.

All front loaders I know (Europe) have programs for all use cases (it's more complicated for sure). But when I compare a usual top loader in the US with a usual front loader in Europa I can relate to the top loader having much more space (when you get space problems in any loader it will not wash good). Never had a problem to wash the largest blanket in a normal front loader here were I live (Germany) but we also do…

> All front loaders I know (Europe) have programs for all use cases (it's more complicated for sure).

My US front loader forced water saving mode, it sprayed a light mist of water, which quickly beaded off of synthetics.

It was otherwise a great machine, but until I moved out I had multiple large comforters I couldn't use.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#862

Post by ccanassa »

Isn't that simply a case of survivorship bias? When people see an old tool or appliance that's still working they usually come to the conclusion that old stuff is better, but they fail to realise that for each surviving appliance there was probably many others that didn't pass the test of time due to bad quality or flaws in design.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#863

Post by Arizhel »

luca_ing wrote: post #852
Arizhel wrote: post #833

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With the counterweights, it'd be nice if it was easy to open up the machine and take the counterweight out. This would make it much easier to move a heavy machine up stairs.

Turns out it was, as I found out later. I just have muscle than brains (and not particularly much muscle).

What machine was that?

I've had two front-loading washing machines now with counterweights, and neither one of them was remotely easy to remove the weights in.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#864

Post by greglindahl »

eatbitseveryday wrote: post #844
expnsv_hdphns wrote: post #512

When I went to the first semester of engineering school at the University of Wisconsin - Madison, there was a class called Engineering Professional Development 160: Introduction to Engineering. One of the early class sessions was a lecture from a guy at a power tool company, making some kind of jigsaw or handheld cutting tool. He explicitly told us, paraphrasing, "You don't want to make your product too reliable, bec…

If engineers are taught this, I imagine orgs like NASA, SpaceX, Boeing etc. must surely hire individuals who do not subscribe to this idea. Reliability IS important in these areas. In my opinion, what this individual told you should belong to a business lecture, not engineering. If your systems fail in engineering, you aren't doing your job right.

Making engineering tradeoffs between cost and reliability or performance and reliability is very much a part of many engineering situations.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#865

Post by irrational »

dangerbird2 wrote: post #767
irrational wrote: post #763

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand this if you have any competitors. Whenever I have a product fail, I don't buy any products from that same company again if at all possible. I had a Maytag dishwasher fail. I won't buy (and haven't bought) Maytag dishwashers since.

As the author notes, there is very little real competition in appliance manufacturing, with a few companies making the vast majority of brands out today. If you stop buying a Maytag dishwasher, there is a good chance you'll end up with another brand that happens to be owned by Whirlpool Corporation.

Yeah, I'm aware that Maytag is owned by Whirlpool. For this reason I most recently purchased a Bosch.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#866

Post by iopq »

tormeh wrote: post #558
iopq wrote: post #439

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Usually failure follows a bathtub curve. If you know your appliance will probably break in 10 years, you can still offer a 3 year warranty easily without costing almost any extra.

A 3 year warranty is not the best warranty. It's just the legally required minimum where I'm from. I was thinking more like 10-15 years.

Ha-ha 15 year warranty

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#867

Post by gcb0 »

masklinn wrote: post #597
c3833174 wrote: post #513

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't know why LG does that when Miele only has a dedicated compartment containing the bare motherboard + service manual in plastic bag

Potting is less expensive than designing an entire suspended/isolated container.

This is the subject of this thread. How much "less expensive" you get on a $3~4k machine where the competition is $500. To compare with well built machines going for $3~4k in the 50's

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#868

Post by sunnykgupta »

threepipeproblm wrote: post #564
skywhopper wrote: post #529

I seriously doubt a real study of appliance reliability over the past 70 years would show that the stuff sold in the 50s is actually more reliable or longer-lasting than the stuff sold today. Sure, you can find appliances that old that still work fine, but you don't see the ones that broke down after a year or two--they were junked decades ago and forgotten about. Since you can't grow the supply of working 50-year-ol…

Right, no one would ever make products intentionally worse as part of creeping modernism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoebus_cartel No one would ever, for economic reasons, plan (or just allow) for the lifespan of their products to decrease. http://resource.co/article/lifetimes-household-appliances-be... Technology is always getting better! The old timers who almost universally report this phenomenon just don't kn…

Exhaust Fans have gone from 20 years to 10 years. I wonder what caused this ;)

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#869

Post by donkeyd »

Arizhel wrote: post #832
donkeyd wrote: post #546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On a Dutch TV show they calculated that it's better to buy a cheaper washer that breaks down sooner. After it breaks you will buy a new one, which is often more efficient, saving you more money. Also, the quelity in washing results is often negligible.

This doesn't really make sense. There's only so much efficiency to be gained in washing dishes or clothes; we're reaping a lot of gains here in the last 10 years or so because of electronic controls and sensors, compared to the very simple mechanical systems from decades past. But the efficiency over time will be a curve, with diminishing returns. Basic physics dictates that you can only make cleaning things with wat…

They didn't say you have to replace it every two years, like a phone. Maybe european washers are better, but I've never seen a ~$400 washer fail within 5 years. You can buy 5 of these washers for the price of a $2000 washer. This means that in 25 years (if they fail every 5 years), you would've spent the same amount, but every 5 years, you get newer technology.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#870

Post by luca_ing »

Arizhel wrote: post #863
luca_ing wrote: post #852

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Turns out it was, as I found out later. I just have muscle than brains (and not particularly much muscle).

What machine was that? I've had two front-loading washing machines now with counterweights, and neither one of them was remotely easy to remove the weights in.

Can't be bothered to got to the cellar to look at the type tag. But it was from the '80s I think. Some Miele domestic machine.

And I didn't pay attention to how hard it would be to remove it -- it was already moot by that time. But it is removable.

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