Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah I know how that sounds but it's the most logical explanation.
Alternatively, they don't have a viable business model? This isn't rocket science. If your business can't exist within the law, it doesn't get to exist.
Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
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Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#852Earlier quoted context omitted.
> most businesses in all categories as more people rely on ChatGPT and Claude for discovery What about restaurants, transportation, construction, healthcare, or manufacturing? Will those go out of business too?
The better question is how well they do in a world where you have to pay OpenAI to be included. A local restaurant can likely survive on local advertising, neighborhood traffic, etc. but I’d bet a lot of categories further consolidate to favor larger companies who can negotiate LLM placement deals.
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#853Very sad to hear, I bought Tailwind UI years ago and although it was a lot more expensive than I wanted, I've appreciated the care and precision and highly recommend buying it (It's now called Tailwind Plus) even still (maybe even especially now). Mad props to Adam for his honesty and transparency. Adam if you're reading, just know that the voices criticizing you are not the only voices out there. Thanks for all you'…
Are these components mostly just the HTML styling which would then be easily used in Angular as well, or would it be too much of a hassle to adopt to Angular?
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#854Earlier quoted context omitted.
The output of AIs that is "churned out" wouldn't exist without templates like this being used as an input to the training. But that isn't "Copyright Infringement", according to the AI companies.
They have more and better lawyers. But I know what feels morally unjust.
This has nothing to do with the actual facts or arguments of the case. Our "Justice" system has openly and capriciously emphasized corporate rights over individual rights for at least 50 years now.
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#855Key comment is this one: https://github.com/tailwindlabs/tailwindcss.com/pull/2388#is... > [...] the reality is that 75% of the people on our engineering team lost their jobs here yesterday because of the brutal impact AI has had on our business. And every second I spend trying to do fun free things for the community like this is a second I'm not spending trying to turn the business around and make sure the people wh…
>The docs are the only way people find out about our commercial products Wall that's the problem, and it's tractable problem. Seems like tailwind needs a sales strategy beyond hoping people read the docs. And that it gives rise to a perverse incentive--making a less intuitive product to drive the need for documentation--is bound to affect the product. If LLMs are really the problem, and it seems possible that they ar…
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#856Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think it's both but I think the end result is less traffic means less sales. I don't have paid ads, everything has been organic with the blog being the main funnel into everything. For quite a few years I tried creating a podcast and also have 5+ years of weekly YouTube videos but the traffic back to the courses from those are close to nothing. Conversion percent rates haven't changed, they have remained consistent…
Thank you for sharing, I really appreciate it! I've been working on my own tech course/education platform for the past couple years, and the landscape seems to be moving beneath our feet!
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#857Earlier quoted context omitted.
> owned by everyone There's no such thing. Even if on paper "everyone" has an ownership share, in practice it's going to be a relatively small number of people who actually exercise all the functions of ownership. The idea that "everyone" can somehow collectively "own" anything is a pipe dream. Ownership in practice is control--whoever controls it owns it. "Everyone" can't control anything. > I really like AI models,…
> we as customers are better off because things we want are cheaper Why privilege that side of the equation over "we as workers"? Being a customer isn't all there is to life. I happen to spend quite a bit more time working than shopping.
It's not a matter of "privilege". It's simple economics: if the same functionality can be provided more cheaply, that's a gain to everyone. The gain to customers is the most obvious gain, and it's what I focused on in my previous post--but it's also a gain to producers, because it frees up resources to produce other things of value. But the producers have to be willing to change how they make use of resources in order to take advantage of those opportunities.
> I happen to spend quite a bit more time working than shopping.
Then you should be a lot more worried about AI providing the same functionality you were providing as a coder, but more cheaply--because that makes you, or at least you as a coder providing that functionality, a commodity that's no longer worth its cost. So if you want to avoid being commoditized and treated like cattle, you have to change what you produce to something that AI can't do more cheaply than you can.
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#858Earlier quoted context omitted.
Some of the critics in the thread are… odious. I’ve written down some of the GH handles, because if I’m ever hiring again, I wanna make sure I’d never hire some of these folks. I don’t understand how someone can display such contempt towards the maintainer of a thing they’ve used for free.
"Sorry, we cannot give you the job because even though you're qualified and passed our interviews, you were such a meano to Adam! That is a no-go at this organization" Who trusted you with hiring
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#859Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’m not sure this is such a reality check. I remember figuring this out maybe a month or so after October 2023, when ChatGippity first dropped. Like, if it’s a “do anything platform” won’t the first anything be to cannibalize low hanging anything’s, followed by progressively higher hanging anything’s until there’s no work left? Like play out AI, it sucks for everybody except the ones holding the steering wheel, unles…
> Like play out AI, it sucks for everybody except the ones holding the steering wheel Not true. Models don't make owners money sitting there doing nothing - they only get paid when people find value in what AI is producing for them. The business model of AI companies is actually almost uniquely honest compared to rest of software industry: they rent you a tool that produces value for you. No enshittification, no dark…
The people "finding value in them" are other people with money to throw at businesses: investors, capital firms, boards & c suites. I'm not sure anybody who has been laid off because their job got automated away is "finding value" in an LLM. There's a handful of scrappy people trying to pump out claude-driven startups but if one person can solo it, obviously a giant tech company can compete.
> No dark patterns
> No enshittification
> No taking your data hostage
blank stare they're not taking my data hostage, but they're sure as shit taking my data
I think we just fundamentally disagree on all of this. You may be right, and I hope you are. I go back and forth on whether it's going to be a gentle transition or a miserable one. My money is on the latter.
Re: Creators of Tailwind laid off 75% of their engineering team
#860Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Like play out AI, it sucks for everybody except the ones holding the steering wheel Not true. Models don't make owners money sitting there doing nothing - they only get paid when people find value in what AI is producing for them. The business model of AI companies is actually almost uniquely honest compared to rest of software industry: they rent you a tool that produces value for you. No enshittification, no dark…
> they only get paid when people find value in what AI is producing for them The people "finding value in them" are other people with money to throw at businesses: investors, capital firms, boards & c suites. I'm not sure anybody who has been laid off because their job got automated away is "finding value" in an LLM. There's a handful of scrappy people trying to pump out claude-driven startups but if one person can s…
What's the dark pattern here, exactly? "Selling military-adjacent stuff with an edgy vibe" isn't what's meant by a dark pattern.