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How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

krebsonsecurity.com

851–860 of 994 posts

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#851

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. I'm well-aware of the analogy of the slowly boiled frog, etc. But it's also the slippery-slope fallacy, so... Why are we assuming facts here before we know of them? She is a Turkish national on a student visa. Those folks do NOT (like it or not) have the same rights as citizens. You cannot, for example, support (not saying she's done this, just saying this is the law) an organization designated as an FTO, as a "…

Visa holders have all of what most would consider "foundational rights" as any citizen. They have freedom of speech, assembly, religion, due process, etc. The government revoking a visa based on categories of behavior which are protected by those foundational rights is appalling.

I have looked into the legal basis of this. As a visa holder, you are enjoying a privilege, not a right. And to keep holding that privilege, you cannot openly support enemies of the state. Whether this is actually enforced or not is immaterial- that's the law as it currently stands.

As a citizen, you can verbally support enemies of the state, but you cannot financially support them.

INA § 237(a)(4)(A): If a visa holder engages in activities that endanger public safety or national security, including endorsing terrorist organizations or inciting violence, they can be deported.

Material Support Clause (INA § 212(a)(3)(B)): Even verbal or symbolic support of a designated Foreign Terrorist Organization (FTO) can count as “material support,” which is grounds for both inadmissibility and deportation.

Overstay or Status Violation: If someone is already skating close to the edge (e.g., questionable employment, status lapse), political speech supporting enemies of the state can provide the cherry on top for ICE to act.

Discretionary Revocation: The U.S. can revoke a visa for virtually any reason, especially if the person’s presence is deemed “contrary to U.S. interests.” That doesn't require proof of a crime—just bureaucratic will.

It's always been like this... But now it's controversial, apparently.

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#852

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those links are the same. How do either of those help or hurt Trump?

fixed the link. RE: How do either of those help or hurt Trump? I am not going to speculate that. But looking at the diff of the edit, anything of "substance" is removed from the response, and what remains is a non-answer.

It is both candidates competing to outdo each other on who will drop more bombs. It is a smoking gun, but not in the way you think it is.

That CBS should owe trump money or face any sort of repercussions over the perceived sleight is absolutely ridiculous. This is the behavior of a narcissistic snowflake, not grown man and last of all a president.

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#853
post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you know she wasn't being arrested for one here? Perhaps we could have some sort of public trial where some of her peers -- let's say a dozen -- could hear the facts and decide on whether she's committed a crime.

Perfect example of what I was angling at: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/doj-says-mahmoud-khalil... (Read the 5 paragraphs that begin with "He allegedly did not disclose".) Everyone was up in arms about this guy a few days ago based on "how things looked"; turns out he was willfully hiding multiple affiliations that would have raised red flags against his visa. Which, of course, now raised a giant red flag agai…

I wonder why you didn't quote the text here lol. Did you think we wouldn't click through and read it ourselves?

Listen man, whatever causes you to so willingly believe everything that known grifters and con artists are selling you is the same issue that has you convinced that everyone in your life is part of a vast and deep conspiracy to make you look stupid. You view everyone as being incapable of comprehending, in awe of your problem solving skills and media literacy, and well, you're right for very wrong reasons.

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#854

I thought this country was founded on the principles of enlightenment. And the same principles made it a world leader. Now that enlightenment values are actively being dismantled what next can we expect?

1) Dark enlightenment: https://www.commondreams.org/opinion/dark-enlightenment-elon...

(Does this ring a bell -- as in Dark MAGA?)

2) The Interview Curtis Yarvin Says Democracy Is Done. Powerful Conservatives Are Listening. https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/18/magazine/curtis-yarvin-in...

3) The philosophy behind Trump’s Dark Enlightenment An English magus of anti-democratic neoreaction has become a touchstone for the alt-right https://archive.is/SWAFE

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#855

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there is a very tenuous relationship with the right to petition. perhaps we should create an amendment enshrining those values The USA already did: The first amendment literally includes the right to petition one's government, along with the other rights listed in the article as section headers. > just because the president is president does not mean they must relinquish the right to legal redress for existing prot…

> The USA already did: you missed my point, clearly. if FOIA protects a current constitutional right, it is at best the tenth amendment, not the first. > Libel of public figures literally requires a higher standard than "the rest of us". to the point where the right to redress is abrogated?

> if FOIA protects a current constitutional right, it is at best the tenth amendment, not the first.

This article is about the entire first amendment, not just FOIA or transparency in general.

> to the point where the right to redress is abrogated?

Certainly to the point where it requires a higher standard than "the rest of us".

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#856
post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the agency that arrested her told us why she was arrested, and it was "supporting terrorism" ie writing an oped opposing israel's genocide, when they certainly have no hesitation to mention the crimes when they are there?? Oh and the agency already has a well documented history of arresting innocent people? Look up "ice collateral arrests" "autism awareness deportation" or "soccer coach deported for real madr…

[flagged]

>autism deportation

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2025/03/trump-el-salvad...

https://www.keranews.org/immigration/2025-03-28/dallas-man-m...

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic...

>ice collateral arrests

https://www.reddit.com/r/law/s/GKVwaG1x1i (fox news video clip of tom Homan - trumps border czar -admitting it)

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/boston/news/boston-ice-arrests-c...

https://newrepublic.com/post/193142/trump-border-czar-tom-ho...

https://www.wbur.org/news/2025/03/26/massachusetts-ice-colla...

Is straight from the horse's mouth enough for you? I could go on and on and on if you wanna keep getting owned by receipts.

>I'm sorry you see...next time

You're the one who can't even find sources I found in 30 sec, but I'm the one who needs a critical thinking cap? You're a joke and you would've supported the nazis because "cmon, it's just a few cherry picked millions who got caught up in that!" Perhaps your desire to lick the boot outweighs your critical thinking skills. If you knew anything about how fascist regimes work you'd know this is simply stage one, not some anomalous happenstance.

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#857

This is a really good compilation that should make any "free-speech absolutist" reconsider their support for the current administration. In my understanding, the commonplace interpretation of the first amendment is largely due to a series of landmark cases through the early to mid-20th century. A lot of expansions were provided to the amendment that have been taken for granted since then and we are now going to see c…

> This is a really good compilation that should make any "free-speech absolutist" reconsider their support for the current administration. The adoption of the "free speech absolutist" brand by certain elements of the Right was never an honest statement of ideology, it was a smokescreen of Orwellian doublespeak for efforts to impose right-wing bias on platforms both by platform owners and by government regulatory effo…

Then the center-left Democrat progressives need to stop discussing the term "free speech absolutism" because it conceptually muddies the water. Leftists believe in free speech, freedom of inquiry, freedom of the press, even "burden of proof beyond doubt"--these are all liberal ideas. There's a mainstream pseudo-left that has decided to dispense with all nuance of these basic liberal values, and that is far worse in the long run, because that is happening inside the house, in service of Democrat elites. It's like internalized oppression: the fascists and reactionaries are so bad, that we've decided to forget our own principles.

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#858
post #567

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, but I still see value in wasting my working hours making sure people here at least see the reality. All I have to offer this forum while I'm a student is politics, which I do know better than at least some here. There is no technology I can really offer a valuable opinion on, more than the experts here. It's my armchair activism to at least make sure that the left's point of view is not wholly absent on this…

It would be better if your goal was not to make "the left's point of view" more well-known (which is just pushing an ideology), but to call out unsubstantiated rightwing BS using evidence and reason.

They're the same picture meme goes here.

Left wing positions, while they control no branches of the government and have no power is literally to raise alarms about what the fascists are doing, and how silly their propagandized reasoning is. That is exactly what I'm doing.

pushing ideology of anti fascists == calling out right wing bs using evidence (climate change, vaccine science, hell, any scientific research at this point all tick both of your boxes)

My last comment had about six sources, but I could find dozens more if you still find yourself blind and tasting fascist boot.

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#859

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plenty, and it's all pretty ugly https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmer_Raids

So you're saying it hasn't happened in 4-5 generations? While certainly precedent, it's understandable people are worried about it.

Eh, similar stuff has happened more recently. Like Obama canceling Israeli nuclear scientists' visas so they couldn't attend a conference. Again, these things have gone on for a long time, just not at the scope/intensity we see now. The lower intensity instances are rarely reported on and gives people the impression that this is new.

Re: How each pillar of the First Amendment is under attack

#860

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course people are allowed to say MAGA-phobic things online or downtown, but that would surely make some of their coworkers uncomfortable and that's pretty disqualifying from most employment. You're allowed to say things, but colleagues are allowed to respond in kind within the law.

I'm not certain what MAGA-phobic could mean etymologically, since a "phobia" is an irrational fear of something, such as an irrational fear of people transitioning sex. Opposition to MAGA is typically rooted in the very rational and well-evidenced fear that one might be persecuted for their religious affiliation or sexuality, among other things.

> Opposition to MAGA is typically rooted in the very rational and well-evidenced fear

Opposition to LGBT is typically rooted in the very rational and well-evidenced fear...

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