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Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

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Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#851

Post by scarface74 »

sjg007 wrote: post #814
scarface74 wrote: post #728

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And by not voting, you don’t get to have your highest priorities addressed. If my highest priority were banning abortion, I would have definitely voted for Trump because he would appoint anti-abortion justices. If my highest priority was criminal justice reform - I would vote for Clinton. Yes, I know she and her husband were part of the problem in the 90s.

Your argument makes no sense and is predicated upon an unknown future. Logically, you support who you vote for. Every politician breaks campaign promises and Trump is no exception. Now if you donate or otherwise contribute a lot of money to a candidate then they will support you. That much is clear and it does not take a lot of money. The only reason we don't have gun control is because the gun lobby has enough votes…

Define "gun control" with specifics? I'm not against gun control for the reason most people are. For me, it's more practical. The government has never been able to successful ban anything that people wanted - e.g. "The War on Drugs". When they do have a "War" on anything, it's usually not evenly applied.

Ronald Reagan was all for gun control in the 60s as was the NRA when the Black Panther Party started legally walking around with guns in California (the Muliford Act). You want to see gun control? Start encouraging as many minorities as possible to apply for open carry permits.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#852

Post by kelukelugames »

ameister14 wrote: post #845
kelukelugames wrote: post #810

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any examples where people are criticizing the concept inherently? The people who write about these things always say they don't like when the word meritocracy is being used to hide bias.

Most of mine are from conversations with people, but this is what I immediately thought of (though I know the definition has changed a little since) https://books.google.com/books?id=QelNAQAAQBAJ Here's another: https://practicaltheorist.wordpress.com/2012/11/14/the-myth-... Here's a critique stating that the terms aren't defined enough to be said to be 'just' http://assets.press.princeton.edu/chapters/s6818.pdf The…

The wordpress article says academic meritocracy doesn't exist because teachers are biased. The author is calling it a myth to say it exists in our society. Doesn't seem like they are against an actual meritocracy.

Though I suppose it's easier to dismiss complaints about bias when we pretend those complainers just hate our meritocracy.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#853

Post by bmm6o »

leereeves wrote: post #792
bmm6o wrote: post #778

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The End of Men ... What if modern, postindustrial society is simply better suited to women? TheCoelocanth already beat me to it, but this article doesn't do any celebrating about the "end of men". It's very sympathetic about how the changing US economy has gutted many traditionally-male fields. And in so far as support for Trump is driven by the economic uncertainty of men, it does a lot to explain that component.…

It's a shame you don't have any free time. If you did, I'd recommend searching for "the future is female" and seeing how deep the rabbit hole goes. But since you don't, what exactly do you expect me to say here that will convince you in 30 seconds?

The Atlantic article was quite long and I read it in a good-faith effort to follow up on your citations, so you can drop the condescension. Elsewhere you concede that it's not the celebratory article you promised, so at least we agree about that.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#854

Post by leereeves »

scarface74 wrote: post #849
leereeves wrote: post #840

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now count how many are willing to speak up in favor of bringing manufacturing jobs back to the US or in favor of race-blind admissions. Count how many have done so and kept their jobs. If all you care about is skin color you're missing my point.

Are they also willing to speak up against "legacy admissions"? I doubt very seriously that people are opposed to bringing back jobs to America. What politician has a platform of "we want to send jobs overseas"?

Bringing jobs back to America does seem reasonable, right? But as far as I've seen, very few leaders in academia, business, government, or the media have spoken against globalization.

Of course, I might be wrong, so please feel free to show me the many leaders who've opposed globalization and the receptive responses of the institutions they work for.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#855

Post by leereeves »

scarface74 wrote: post #850
peoplewindow wrote: post #847

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how many of them are in those positions because their professorship was advertised as being exclusively for white men only? How many of them were unqualified, but given the job over a more qualified woman, just because they were a man? I'm sure there are cases of that happening, somewhere. But I can point to multiple examples in the past year alone of jobs being advertised explicitly and in writing as not being o…

You can speak anecdotally all day long. But can you show studies where controlling for all other variables, white men are less likely to get jobs, promotions, raises, leases mortgages, accepted into college, etc.?

Men are only about 40% of college students. Male unemployment is higher. I have no data on the others.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#856

Post by orwellian »

sctb wrote: post #799
orwellian wrote: post #789

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* Climate change isn’t a liberal fact vs some conservative alternate truth; climate change is a scientific fact. * Evolution isn’t an atheist fact vs some religious alternate truth; evolution is a scientific fact. * Personality differences (note: not to be confused with IQ or proficiency!) between male and female isn’t a conservative fact vs some liberal alternate; it’s a scientific fact. Damore suggested we use thes…

Please stop deleting and reposting comments.

Sorry about that. I had some typos I was trying to correct but the edit feature wasn’t working (it submitted with no error, but nothing changed).

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#857

Post by scarface74 »

leereeves wrote: post #854
scarface74 wrote: post #849

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are they also willing to speak up against "legacy admissions"? I doubt very seriously that people are opposed to bringing back jobs to America. What politician has a platform of "we want to send jobs overseas"?

Bringing jobs back to America does seem reasonable, right? But as far as I've seen, very few leaders in academia, business, government, or the media have spoken against globalization. Of course, I might be wrong, so please feel free to show me the many leaders who've opposed globalization and the receptive responses of the institutions they work for.

There is a difference between “speaking against globalizarion” and increasing jobs in America. How do you propose we decrease globalization? Impose tariffs, cause a trade war, and increase prices for everyone?

There is a company called Softwear trying to brIng clothe manufacturing back to the US. But they plan to automate everything and hire a very few engineers. How does that help the “working class”?

The ship on globalization has sailed. Republicans use to believe in the free market that was back when manufacturing jobs were strong. But now that the “working class in middle America” is hurting, they like “big government” interfering with the free market. and more regulation because it helps them.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#858

Post by scarface74 »

leereeves wrote: post #855
scarface74 wrote: post #850

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can speak anecdotally all day long. But can you show studies where controlling for all other variables, white men are less likely to get jobs, promotions, raises, leases mortgages, accepted into college, etc.?

Men are only about 40% of college students. Male unemployment is higher. I have no data on the others.

That’s not what I asked. Can you find studies where equally qualified white men were denied opportunities, controlling for all other variables suffered harm because of their color or gender? I can post studies where the opposite has happened in housing, hiring, and the criminal justice system.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#859

Post by jonathankoren »

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #746
jonathankoren wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone can have "unfashionable" opinions. It's just that they can't also dictate how other people react to those opinions. There's nothing more libertarian than holding people accountable by exercising free association, or in this case, freedom to not associate.

Do you think it's good for a democracy if someone's career is limited by their political beliefs? Keep in mind too, these aren't fringe political beliefs. It's generally accepted in non-western countries that men and women are different, for example, yet somehow that's a fireable offense here.

The unemployed get to vote.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#860

Post by andrewjl »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #641
otterley wrote: post #634

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s very easy to contemplate how to solve this problem: make it easy to build extremely dense housing in SF. The problem is that the powers that be don’t want to make it easier, and they all have ultimately self serving excuses as to why. Every time a politician tells me more housing won’t make it cheaper, I posit the hypothetical “what if we built 100,000 more units? No? How about 1 million more? 5 million more?” T…

Unfortunately, it isn't actually that simple. Since WW2, the vast majority of our financing mechanisms and housing policy has been aimed at creating family housing because that was what the parents of the Baby Boomers wanted and needed. Meanwhile, our population has diversified away from that. Plus there are myriad zoning policies, tax policies etc at all levels of government that are pieces of the puzzle for how SF…

SF is already notoriously family unfriendly. The side effects you're describing sound like they'd impact suburban areas more so than the city.

SF needs an overhauled planning process and possibly a way to fast track review of housing in already over priced areas that can contribute to a reduction in median rent.

Edit: what is also clear is that the longer we delay these changes the more A) folks will get displaced that wouldn't have otherwise and B) the greater backlog of housing will need to be built to make up for past deficit and correspondingly the greater magnitude of change to the city in a shorter time (which I agree with you should be minimized to a reasonable extent)

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