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Tesla ending Models S and X production

cnbc.com

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Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#841

Post by notabee »

outside1234 wrote: post #768
sgjohnson wrote: post #485

Tesla will become a case study on how to completely waste the first-mover advantage. For many people, the very term EV itself is still ubiquitous to Tesla. And somehow Tesla is still worth more than every other non-Chinese automaker combined. $1.5T. GM? $80B. Stellantis? $40B. Toyota? $280B. Mercedes-Benz? $60B. BMW? $55B. Volkswagen Group? Also $55B. I’m sure I’ve missed plenty of others, but I could miss some 18 $5…

We are in a time when people are in cults. Trump is a cult. Elon is a cult. Tesla is a cult. Cults do not operate on logic, but almost always result in a mass casualty event of some sort.

It's baked into the foundations of the U.S. While perhaps not a cult as we describe it today, even the first puritans that settled here were considered extremists not welcome in their home countries. For such a young country, we have always had a burgeoning industry in upstart cults, grifts, and religions (but I repeat myself).

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#842

Post by memish »

root_axis wrote: post #795
gkfasdfasdf wrote: post #780

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And to add insult to injury, even GM Super Cruise is widely renowned as better and safer than Tesla’s current “FSD”. Do you have any sources for that claim? I can attest that current iteration of FSD is very, very good, and very likely is a safer driver than I am. At least one major insurance company agrees [0]. I don't have any experience with Super Cruise though. [0] - https://www.lemonade.com/fsd

> Do you have any sources for that claim? I can attest that current iteration of FSD is very, very good, and very likely is a safer driver than I am. That's a damning statement about your driving skills, and probably not true or you'd have had your license revoked by now. I've had FSD for five years, and even today it regularly makes dangerous mistakes. For example, left turns and roundabouts are the equivalent of Ru…

Do you think your anecdote is more likely to be true than an insurance company putting its money where its mouth is?

"Tesla Full Self-Driving is twice as safe, so Lemonade takes 50% off every mile driven with FSD."

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#844

Post by groos »

hbarka wrote: post #812
philistine wrote: post #774

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most probably because it has a radar that the Tesla lacks. That means your car has two sources of truth and can very efficiently and quickly make an informed decision about whether or not there's anything in the way.

My Model 3 has radar. It’s no longer functional and just a useless appendage. Until 2020-21 all Tesla had radar but Musk directed Tesla to disable the radar from the software stack, nerfing this hardware on tens of thousands of cars. Why? Because he staked on camera-only and to find out there’s still radar fusion would be against that. The real truth is probably they were derisking the part cost (during Covid) and th…

My 8 yo M3 has radar and it still is active since the yellow radar symbols light up when passing by obstacles. It's also used to figure out obstacles in the front and back and if disabled, the relatively poor cameras on my car would not be able to figure out the distance to the next car in the front.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#845

Post by LandoCalrissian »

lacker wrote: post #314
riffraff wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you expect the demand for Tesla's robotaxis to be high? I don't see it.

If they actually worked right now, the demand would be high. Demand is certainly high for Waymos. Even if they worked worse than a Waymo I think the demand would still be very high. But it's hard to tell if (or when) it will work well enough to actually be a real product.

Probably not a great strategy to piss off every blue voter in the country and then try to setup a business in cities.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#846

Post by WorldMaker »

jeltz wrote: post #88
addaon wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why is it seen initially so negatively? They went from being able to profitably produce a luxury car, to not being able to profitably produce a luxury car, to not being able to produce a luxury car at all. All while becoming uncompetitive in the econobox market, and losing huge chunks of it even before their real competitors arrive in market…

Yeah, in Europe Tesla is not losing to BYD. They are losing to VW and BMV before the Chinese manufacturers have entered the competition for real.

And Renault and Dacia and MG and…

Europe doesn't seem to want for EV competition in anything like the same way that the US is falling behind.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#847

Post by jasondigitized »

johnfn wrote: post #192
adastra22 wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric cars, maybe. Tesla is valued much larger than the rest of the auto industry combined though. Humanoid robots? Ain’t nobody made the business case for that. It is pure vibes.

Are you seriously saying there is no business case for humanoid robots?

Robots yes. Humanoid ones? Why? So people can be amazed? Purpose built robots are the future. The human form is sub optimal for most enterprise use cases.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#848

Post by apparent »

snek_case wrote: post #730
apparent wrote: post #359

Interesting that they're cutting S/X but keeping the Cybertruck. Whatever metric they're using (revenue, profit, units, etc.) that led them to cut the S/X would surely have similar numbers for the Cybertruck, if not worse.

Part of it is they wanted that factory space at Fremont for the Optimus production line. That's because the Optimus team is located there, in Silicon Valley.

Wondered about that also. Seems like a really big decision to cut off the S and X though! Will they have something else to offer customers who want something more than a Y?

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#849

Post by WorldMaker »

groundzeros2015 wrote: post #747
tensor wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not surprised at the X, but the S has always been the flagship model with all the best features and the top performance. The 3 is a fine mid-sized car but it's very strange to get rid of your flagship model. Those always cater to a small audience anyways.

What if they have planned product lines we don’t know about.

Then the smarter PR move would be to tease those before announcing massive cuts?

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#850

Post by WarmWash »

IncreasePosts wrote: post #831
terminalbraid wrote: post #784

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Trust me, I hate Tesla and Elon as much as the next naysayer But then you go to defend them as if it were something you're obligated to do. I think you demonstrably do not hate Tesla and Elon as much as the next naysayer.

I call this the 12 fingered hitler, frequently seen on reddit. It goes like this: Person A makes up some unsupported fact about a despised figure. For example, "Hitler had 12 fingers". Person B comes in and says "I think Hitler just had 10 fingers like normal" And then person A or some other person responds "holy shit dude, I can't believe you're defending Hitler!"

Exactly

And then neo nazis go around telling susceptible people "Look, Hitler's detractors think he had 12 fingers, just look at any picture of him, he clearly only has 10. You're gonna trust people that stupid to be honest about him? To know anything about him?"

Disinformation feels good in the moment, but is immensely damaging overall. Even the people who believed he had 12 fingers will feel betrayed and question everything else when they one day learn he actually had 10.

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